Future of Meier building? - Page 2 — Brooklynian

Future of Meier building?

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  • it's not a "claim" that 50% have sold, all you need to do is go to streeteasy and see that 53 units have been sold. supposedly there were originally planned to be around 100 units, but that number was decreased when they realized that larger units were selling better, so they combined some and made fewer units.

    53 sold. (some for OBSCENE prices)
    16 for sale currently.
    not sure if there are others waiting in the wings, but at least 50% have sold.

    http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/building/1-grand-army-plaza-brooklyn
  • maybe they'll rent out the billards room to raise some cash.

    ...children's birthdays.

    ...Brooklynian gatherings?
  • six months later, about 20% of the apartments appear to be occupied.

    ...and, to my horror and amusement, this week they began advertising that the public could now park in their very empty garage on a monthly and hourly basis.

    I guess they had to get some revenue somehow.

    ...it wasn't coming from sales or maintenance fees.
  • A friend who is in contract there says they aren't closing b/c they are having financing problems & some in contract are taking legal action to either spur their closing or to get out.

    On a different note, the old pool table & the trendy black light fixtures seem kind of incongruous there. I imagined some elegant Italian leather sofas.
  • What's the monthly rate? It's such a good location for me that I'd almost consider getting a car if the rate was competitive enough.

    I wonder if they'd consider permanently selling a parking space. Any ideas what that would go for?
  • I don't know the monthly rate ...but I think it is posted on the wall.

    Last night, it didn't like like they were open yet, just getting ready.

    ...Yea, maybe they'll be desperate enough to rent out the room with the pool table and widescreen TV to us.

    man, they would have to be desperate to do that.
  • Carnivore wrote: What's the monthly rate? It's such a good location for me that I'd almost consider getting a car if the rate was competitive enough.

    I wonder if they'd consider permanently selling a parking space. Any ideas what that would go for?
    From what I have seen on Brownstoner and other sites buildings sell parking spaces between $35,000 and $50,000.
  • Yeah - some in the slope were going up over $70k a while back....but monthly parking is more expensive there as well. I think that new builidng on Sterling east of Washington has spaces for sale...maybe you could get a comp there.

    The new parking sign is really ugly and out of place with the fancy-pants glass aesthetic, btw.
  • arches wrote:

    The new parking sign is really ugly and out of place with the fancy-pants glass aesthetic, btw.
    ...desperation always is.
  • can we still throw dead birds at the meier compound?
  • whynot_31 wrote: [quote=arches]

    The new parking sign is really ugly and out of place with the fancy-pants glass aesthetic, btw.
    ...desperation always is.

    i agree. can't believe that garish, circus- like sign is richard meier approved. you design a building meticulously, adding countless stipulations about what sort of curtains, etc the residents can have consistent with the building's aesthetic, and then they turn the garage into a honky tonk.
  • Crazy thing... more than a dozen condos have gone under contract at the M Building this spring, according to StreetEasy.

    image

    (It's hard to find the listings, since they don't appear under the building's listing. Instead I looked at all the activity in PH, in order by the most expensive.)
  • whynot_31 wrote: I don't know the monthly rate ...but I think it is posted on the wall.

    Last night, it didn't like like they were open yet, just getting ready.

    ...Yea, maybe they'll be desperate enough to rent out the room with the pool table and widescreen TV to us.

    man, they would have to be desperate to do that.
    I've only seen people playing on that table once in the whole time it's been there. :lol:

    I like the fact the people that bought the place above that room have to deal with the skate boarders doing tricks under their windows on Eastern Parkway. Plus they paid all that money to have their window shades up all the time.

    :lol:
  • Carnivore wrote: What's the monthly rate? It's such a good location for me that I'd almost consider getting a car if the rate was competitive enough.

    I wonder if they'd consider permanently selling a parking space. Any ideas what that would go for?
    $225/mo, according to flyers they've been leaving around. Don't know if that some special teaser rate or what. I would have expected it to be higher than the places on Underhill, but I think that's actually a little cheaper.
  • at what point will we be able to park in the spaces that were going to be apartments?
  • arches wrote: [quote=Carnivore]What's the monthly rate? It's such a good location for me that I'd almost consider getting a car if the rate was competitive enough.

    I wonder if they'd consider permanently selling a parking space. Any ideas what that would go for?
    $225/mo, according to flyers they've been leaving around. Don't know if that some special teaser rate or what. I would have expected it to be higher than the places on Underhill, but I think that's actually a little cheaper.

    I would make some points:

    Generally, when more inventory comes online, prices go down, not up.

    This is a recession and cars are not necessities in New York City, so demand for spaces may be falling (arguable but possible).

    Finally, most people don't care if they have a fancy pants garage or basic or even ugly one, as long as its covered and gaurded. The value is proximty to one's residence (vs price).
  • Lo Kee wrote:
    I would make some points:

    Generally, when more inventory comes online, prices go down, not up.

    This is a recession and cars are not necessities in New York City, so demand for spaces may be falling (arguable but possible).

    Finally, most people don't care if they have a fancy pants garage or basic or even ugly one, as long as its covered and gaurded. The value is proximty to one's residence (vs price).
    Yes, proximity is why i find the price to be low. The garage is a 2 minute walk from the place on Flatbush/Plaza street that charges $300 or so. And a 5 minute walk from places in Park Slope that charge $400+. I suspect they will raise the prices once they fill the garage.
  • We got a spot for $225/month + tax. No real catch. Just a lot of supply. Nice folks that work there too (the garage is a separate business from the condo.)

    It's all month-to-month, and I also suspect that prices will "correct" when the economy gets better.
    arches wrote: [quote=Carnivore]What's the monthly rate? It's such a good location for me that I'd almost consider getting a car if the rate was competitive enough.

    I wonder if they'd consider permanently selling a parking space. Any ideas what that would go for?
    $225/mo, according to flyers they've been leaving around. Don't know if that some special teaser rate or what. I would have expected it to be higher than the places on Underhill, but I think that's actually a little cheaper.
  • arches wrote: [quote=Lo Kee]
    I would make some points:

    Generally, when more inventory comes online, prices go down, not up.

    This is a recession and cars are not necessities in New York City, so demand for spaces may be falling (arguable but possible).

    Finally, most people don't care if they have a fancy pants garage or basic or even ugly one, as long as its covered and gaurded. The value is proximty to one's residence (vs price).
    Yes, proximity is why i find the price to be low. The garage is a 2 minute walk from the place on Flatbush/Plaza street that charges $300 or so. And a 5 minute walk from places in Park Slope that charge $400+. I suspect they will raise the prices once they fill the garage.

    those prices are ridiculous. I pay $180 nearby.
  • indeed, they are. where do you park for $180?
  • "whynot_31" wrote: [quote=arches]


    i agree. can't believe that garish, circus- like sign is richard meier approved. you design a building meticulously, adding countless stipulations about what sort of curtains, etc the residents can have consistent with the building's aesthetic, and then they turn the garage into a honky tonk
    Strangely, I can't believe the building design itself is Meier-approved.
  • Subject: parking for $180

    Yes, pray tell. Lo Kee. i am looking for a new parking spot. Can you please divulge where you park for $180?
  • ouch. this Brownstoner posts points out the a unit just went for more than 40% under the original asking price.

    2. PROSPECT HEIGHTS $1,665,000
    1 Grand Army Plaza/On Prospect Park, Unit 11B GMAP (right)
    According to its listing, this unit in the Meier-designed condo is 2,125 square feet and has three bedrooms. The buyers got quite a discount: It was asking $2.8 million, according to Corcoran Sunshine's rundown on the condo. Entered into contract on 5/12/09; closed on 6/16/09; deed recorded on 7/6/09.

    Do you have a lot of $ laying around, and a willingness to have my dog and look in on you at midnight?

    There seem to be lots more units available: http://www.corcoran.com/property/nd/detail_listings.aspx?ndevid=291&userid=

    ....take 40% off of asking :)
  • whynot_31 wrote: There seem to be lots more units available: http://www.corcoran.com/property/nd/detail_listings.aspx?ndevid=291&userid=

    ....take 40% off of asking :)
    Ouch indeed. One question though. A lot say they are in contract. Would it be fair to say that a proportion (maybe all) of those listed as under contract are people who signed that contract a couple of years ago when times were good and are now desperately trying to either get out of the contract without losing too much money or stuck with an over priced white elephant? Or are they newly signed bargain hunter contracts?
  • I, of course, don't know. ...but that hasn't stopped me from typing before, and won't now.

    ...back on topic, for a really long time, the building has claimed to have tons of folks in contract. Making me think that:

    1. People who wanted to buy are now considering walking away from their deposit in order to not lose even more $. ("Um, next tuesday doesn't look good as a closing date ...the next time I'm available is March 12, 2011.")

    2. The landlord is going to approach them with new "reduced prices" that may keep them in contract, but at a lower purchasing price ("you seem to not be returning our calls regarding a closing date. Would you be willing to actually show up if we took $ off? ...we'd tell you we are going to not return your deposit, but that doesn't help us sell units. Damn it, we can't break even by just relisting these things")

    ...maybe they'll throw in curtains.
  • [quote="GOD"]There are people in the building! Coming home with my son we saw a old couple making dinner in the kitchen on the 2nd floor, right on the corner of Eastern Parkway and Plaza street. Looked like a Stanley Kubrick film.

    We know someone who was hired to "occupy" a unit on a low floor facing Eastern Parkway during the Saturday Farmers Market. The same people sit in another apartment on the backside of the building on St.J's during the work week. They are always there when we roll home around 6:30 on week nights. CRAFTY!
  • http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/27/nyregion/27meier.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

    a fluffy article on how the residents are forming support groups in the mostly empty building.

    ...I want to know how long the building will be able to keep up maintenance when they only have 20% of the planned occupants to spread the costs among.
  • i assume the pelting of dead birds is now distateful

    but can we still do it?
  • They may soon be desperate enough to let you do it for a small fee.

    (how does one distaste? ...sounds like a useful skill when eating at strange restaurants)
  • one thinks of a fanciful meal

    and then subtracts
  • http://www.corcoran.com/agents/listings.aspx?region=NYC&userid=1GAP

    It would be nice it they had to state when a unit went into contract, and for how much.

    ...or when a unit "recently sold"

    Asking prices are clearly now below $1000 a sf, but its not clear if most of the prices have fallen 40% (as in the examples above).[/i]
  • I find this post curious because of the price per sq foot of the bldg. There is a city gov proposal to buy and sell apartments in Brooklyn and the Meirer designed bldg is not part of the list yet. People who have bought or are going to buy should check with your council person for a current list. My understanding is it goes something like this. City gov gives apt owners a kickback so that newly constructed unsold apts will be sold for 60 to 70 % of the market value. Lots of services offered like gym/security/front desk/full service stuff does not come on line until bldg is @60% purchased so don't hold your breath if you are in an empty place. If you are paying big maint or hoa fees you should look for cash back if the posh they promised in the sales office starts to look like it's never going to show.The person who told me about this thinks Bloomberg wants to get this program money rolling before the election that was a @month ago.
  • A tax break to entice the wealthy to live locally.

    ...not as much of a tax break as Atlantic Yards received, but still...

    I don't know if I am for it, the developers bore the risk (and potential reward) when they built it. Why should we bail them out?

    I think I would spend some money to build something on the corner of Franklin and EP instead.

    The Meier building could likely rent out the apartments in order to survive.
  • whynot_31 wrote: A tax break to entice the wealthy to live locally.

    ...not as much of a tax break as Atlantic Yards received, but still...

    I don't know if I am for it, the developers bore the risk (and potential reward) when they built it. Why should we bail them out?

    I think I would spend some money to build something on the corner of Franklin and EP instead.

    The Meier building could likely rent out the apartments in order to survive.
    Or get rid of all that wasted space on the ground floor and put some retail business or a restaurant in there.
  • Carnivore wrote: [quote=whynot_31]A tax break to entice the wealthy to live locally.

    ...not as much of a tax break as Atlantic Yards received, but still...

    I don't know if I am for it, the developers bore the risk (and potential reward) when they built it. Why should we bail them out?

    I think I would spend some money to build something on the corner of Franklin and EP instead.

    The Meier building could likely rent out the apartments in order to survive.
    Or get rid of all that wasted space on the ground floor and put some retail business or a restaurant in there.

    Nope. The buildings around the arch, along with most of EP, can't have such a place on their first floor; only "professional spaces" (dentist, MDs, etc). They are zoned wrong.

    The buildings that appear to be violating this actually have street addresses that aren't on the protect St (for example the Dunkin Donuts at the corner of EP and Nostrand, is actually on Nostrand). ....there might have been some zoning exceptions granted, but you get the idea. ...it would be very difficult for them to get a variance.

    (but, yea, a high class restaurant -complete with limos- would be excellent)
  • whynot_31 wrote: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/27/nyregion/27meier.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

    a fluffy article on how the residents are forming support groups in the mostly empty building.

    ...I want to know how long the building will be able to keep up maintenance when they only have 20% of the planned occupants to spread the costs among.
    omg, finally read that article - and I love the idea of this building as a retirement home for my mom! The assisted living place on the corner of the park is $4000/month and up, so . . .
    :D
  • Just in case you are wondering what demographic the developers hope will buy in the building, I give you this advertisement (oh, I'm sorry "event"):

    http://www.momasphere.com/upcoming-events/

    It looks like they are slowly figuring out what to do with that wasted first floor space.

    P.S. I'm being unfair. At this point I'm sure they hope any demographic will buy in the building.
  • bump :)

    It's not new news, but is rehashed old news....

    http://www.brownstoner.com/brownstoner/archives/2010/06/on_prospect_par_2.php

    I love to hate that building.
  • Why is the little note icon thingie on this thread moving around. It is bothering me lol. Is it b/c someone bumped a 9 month old thread?
  • Slowly but surely, this building is selling its units at close to the ORIGINAL ASKING PRICE!

    Via Brownstoner:

    2. PROSPECT HEIGHTS $2,650,000

    1 Grand Army Plaza, #12D GMAP

    #12D is a 2,620-square-foot three bedroom. It was originally listed for $2,850,000 and then got a price boost to $2,950,000. The unit entered contract five months later. Entered into contract on 12/13/10; closed on 1/20/2011; deed recorded on 1/28/11.

    http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/516978-condo-1-grand-army-plaza-prospect-heights-brooklyn

    For those who like percentages, $2,650,000 divided by $2,950,000 = 89.8%

    ....this is despite being originally listed at the peak of the market, and sitting on the market for years.

    Apparently it really is all about having the patience to wait for the right buyer. ....someone just paid a little over a $1000 a sq ft to live in a fancy building on the edge of a neighborhood that frequently goes for around $550 a sq ft.

  • I can't wait for this place to become MY retirement home....I've got my eye on one of the penthouses.....

  • Slowly, but surely, the building continues to sell its units. Sorry, goodprospect, but it was one of the penthouses that you were eyeing....

    As per Brownstoner.com:

    1 Grand Army Plaza, #8F GMAP

    This is the second week in a row OPP has topped the biggest sales list. (There's also another penthouse unit still in contract.) Like last week's unit, this is a three bedroom. It was on the market for $2,900,000 back in 2007 and took about a 27 percent cut. Entered into contract on 10/7/10; closed on 2/9/11.

    For those into math: $2.9M x .73 = $2,117,000.

  • For some reason, the Meier build neglected to invite me to the unveiling of their penthouses!

    Brownstoner reports that the building has finally finished construction, and threw an event last night to show off its nicest units:

    The crown jewel of the evening, Penthouse 16 South, is a four bedroom with three-and-a-half bathrooms that has 3,524 square feet of interior space and 2,582 square feet of outside space. Asking price: $5,100,000. The second unit is #16 North. This is a four bedroom, three-and-a-half bath, with 3,274 square feet of interior space and 3,172 square feet of exterior space. It has a pretty swanky wrap around terrace, including balconies for the second and third bedrooms. The asking price comes in at $4,900,000. Finally, PH 16 West, the only duplex in the development, has three bedrooms and two-and-a-half bathrooms, and it also has a private roof terrace. It's the cheapest of the bunch, asking $2,750,000.

    http://www.brownstoner.com/brownstoner/archives/2011/06/opp_penthouse_p.php#comments

  • Now, the real fun begins.

    The residents have filed suit against the neighboring Temple for having loud parties.

    The temple has rented it's spaces to diverse groups for the last 20 years.

    http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2011/07/opp-owners-arent-down-with-synagogue-parties/?stream=true

  • that seems to deserve a thread of its own ....no?

    what the heck is going on over there???? Kaparos every week????

    [video] [/video]

  • Can anyone (outside of OPP residents) vouch for the noise?

  • I can only vouch that since 2003, I have seen many well dressed people leave the venue between 11 PM and 1AM. The venue doesn't seem to host low end clienteles.

    (hence I have never been inside)

    When I hang out on Sepias patio, I can hear sometimes hear the parties at the temple.

    I imagine the glass walls transfer the noise a lot, but suspect the Meier residents will need some objective proof that the noise codes are being violated to win their suit.

  • Still selling, but at a discount....

    1. PROSPECT HEIGHTS $1,733,000

    1 Grand Army Plaza, #6G GMAP P*Shark

    The listing says this unit includes, “Westerly exposure with cityscape and tree top views, privately positioned Master bedroom suite, extra large 2nd and 3rd bedrooms with a shared walk in closet and a sundrenched all glass home office.” 2,107 square feet, five bed/four bath, asking $2,140,000 in 2008. Entered into contract on 10/10/11; closed on 11/21/11; deed recorded on 12/09/2011.

    Source: Brownstoner.com

    2107/$1,733,000 = $822 a sq ft.

  • Let me get my check book.

  • karl checks his satchel

    for westerly exposure

    such a deal of deals

  • Several years have passed.

    Only 20% of the units are left!

    brownstoner wrote: We haven’t checked in on sales at the Richard Meier-designed On Prospect Park for quite some time, but a press release that was sent out this morning brings us up-to-date on what’s going on with the condo: Brown Harris Stevens is the development’s new broker, taking over from Corcoran to market the remaining 21 unsold units in the building. The release notes that 10 of the unsold condos have been put on the market and that some are “price-improved.” A quick scan of StreetEasy reveals some of the price cuts: A two-bedroom that was listed for $935,000 when Corcoran had the listing is now asking $850,000; another two bedroom has dropped in price from $945,000 to $895,000; and a three-bedroom last listed for $1,800,000 is now asking $1,700,000. The building is 80 percent sold overall.

    source: http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2012/01/new-brokers-some-price-cuts-for-opps-remaining-units/#disqus_thread

  • Brownstoner wrote: This weekend’s real estate section in the Times had a story examining how buildings constructed with “starchitects” at the design helm—Richard Meier, Enrique Norten, Robert A. M. Stern, et al.—are not necessarily holding value on the resale market or having a smashing sales run from the get-go. The two Brooklyn examples mentioned are Meier’s On Prospect Park (a.k.a. 1 Grand Army Plaza) and Norten’s 580 Carroll Street. The former has seen price cuts and is nearly 80 percent sold since hitting the market in 2007, and the latter still has 10 of its 17 units unspoken for after being on the market for about two years, as we reported last week. Both Meier and Norten have quotes in the article saying that perhaps the locations of the buildings deterred would be buyers. For example: “Mr. Norten ascribed the sluggish sales mainly to the building’s location. It is on Carroll Street, near Fourth Avenue, the far western edge of Park Slope. ‘I think the developers were very brave in trying to upgrade with different architecture there,’ he said. ‘They were taking a risk.’” (In the case of OPP, though, location can hardly be blamed, since many would consider it one of the the premier locations in Brooklyn.) Leaving aside the fact that brand-name cachet is probably not as valuable as it was in the real estate boom years, do you think starchitect pedigree will always be a somewhat tougher sell in a borough better known for its stately brownstones and handsome prewar apartment buildings? Or, you know, maybe the price is just too damn high on the starchitect condos that have come to market here!

    source: http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2012/03/has-starchitecture-lost-its-luster/#disqus_thread

  • Today, the building finally sold its final unit.

    The building was completed in 2005.

    ...the present year is 2012.

    http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2012/07/1-grand-army-plaza-officially-sold-out/#disqus_thread

  • whynot_31 said:

    The building was completed in 2005.

    The building was announced in 2005. There were no apartments for sale there until 2008, and the very article you point to notes that the penthouses weren't finished until 2010 (and one of the commenters suggested that the roof was still unfinished).

  • True.

    But arguably the building took so long to complete because sales were so slow, and the 2008 stock disaster affected its potential buyers more than those of a regular building.

    At one point, people in contract to buy the units were doing things like delaying their closing date, because they feared they were entering into a bad investment.

    I'm sure they expected it to take a while to sell such innovative and expensive designs in this neighborhood, but I wonder how much $ they lost (profit not earned?) as a result of the time it took to finally sell out.

    Would the developers do it again? Was their ROI ok?

    BTW, Fresh Direct does well at this location.

  • not surprised Fresh Direct does well....the kitchens are too small to do any real cooking!

  • The Meier building has become one of the first in NYC to ban smoking indoors.

    ...you can't even smoke in your own apartment:

    http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2012/12/26/richard_meiers_on_prospect_park_bans_smoking_indoors.php#reader_comments

  • I wonder how encompassing this is. Can I burn incense? Use tobacco with a vaporizer?

  • When it is time to sell a unit, I assume that only non-smokers will be interested.

    This reduces the pool of buyers, but makes the property more attractive to some.

    Does this increase property value?

This discussion has been closed.