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the madness at 14-20 butler has got to stop! ever since they renovated the buildings, all of the families who used to live there have moved and out they've been replaced by young, post-college types who have parties on the roof til 5 am, have ridiculous photoshoots and interpretive dance rehearsals up there, and now - the attack of the penis! i live on the top floor of my building on st. john's, and the buildings my apt faces are lower - only 4 floors. we have curtains, but don't freak out about it unless someone's on the roof or something. but the new people in the top floor apartment on butler across from my apartment? they couldn't care less who can see them. right now, as i type, dude is laying naked on top of the covers on a bed right next to the window, with his junk all flappin' in the breeze. i can't even imagine the view my downstairs neighbors have, as they're RIGHT ACROSS from him. i had gotten used to seeing the girl who lives there lounging in her underwear on her laptop, but this full-frontal shit has got to stop. so, suggestions? really, i'm so temtped to post a picture.
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I think you should post a pic. Do you think the dude is aware of the fact that people can see his rod?Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
Most people round us are heavily curtained types. We're open. It's a cultural thing. I figure if you don't like what you see, you don't have to watch.The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln
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What do you mean about "heavily curtained types"?Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
mypasswordwontwork » What do you mean about "heavily curtained types"?
I mean their curtains are almost always drawn, so we couldn't see in even if we were interested. Ours are generally open, so people can see in if they can be bothered. Quality of light is more important to me than worrying about what someone else might see or think.The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln -
I agree with Doctorj. I don't have curtains because everyone around me has literally barricaded themselves in with curtains. I do think its a a cultural thing. People of African descent like curtains. Many of the new white people moving in don't have curtains. Its cool. Different strokes for different folks. The only time I miss curtains is when I'm trying to watch TV in the daytime or when the sun fades my sofa. I'm guilty of walking 'round the apartment in my undies---sans curtains...sorry.
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RBG » People of African descent like curtains. Many of the new white people moving in don't have curtains.
i couldn't agree with you more. the first thing i do when i get home is draw my curtains. if my parents ever come to visit and my curtains are open, they bug out.... black people like their curtains closed. and sometimes when i forget, i am swiftly reminded that i need to shut them because i see the white girl across the street from me sitting at her puter topless. she's got great new york boobs and all.... but you won't see me giving my neighbors across the way free peep shows!my beat is correct. -
I don't think it's particularly an African thing, but if you or your family have lived near the North Pole, you have a different tradition regarding light than if you're from the tropics, and New York is halfway and has a mix of people from North and South. On top of that, the general level of hysteria here regarding visibility of flesh is greater here than in some countries, less than in others.The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln
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i, too, walk around sans-coulottes in my apartment quite often, and like i said, i don't go nuts with the curtains, unless i think there's a reason. but come on, dude, you don't have to put that shit on display... it was like testicles on a platter, served up for me before coffee. yeesh. i did snap a photo or two, by the way. we'll see where they end up.
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one of my favorite quotes from my time living in crown heights happened the night of the west indian day parade. i was sitting in my room (on the second floor, window overlooking the street) and some kids in their teens were hanging around the front gate and one said "i don't care if you live in the taj mahal, close your damn shades!" my shades normally are closed, but it was so nice and breezy that night! maybe i should have left my pants on though...I've done a lot of lying in my time. I've lied to men who wear belts. I've lied to men who wear suspenders. But I'd never be so stupid as to lie to a man who wears both belt and suspenders.
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crustythor » i did snap a photo or two, by the way. we'll see where they end up.
oh man! you gotta share these!!!!my beat is correct. -
doctorj » I don't think it's particularly an African thing, .
I'm confused. Is the implication that African people like their curtains closed or that Black Americans like their curtains closed? Obviously those are some vastly different cultures and "African" obviously encompasses everything from Moroccan to Maasai to to Egyptian to Senegalese.... all cultures that are very distinct from Black American culture.Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
doctorj » I don't think it's particularly an African thing, but if you or your family have lived near the North Pole, you have a different tradition regarding light than if you're from the tropics, and New York is halfway and has a mix of people from North and South. On top of that, the general level of hysteria here regarding visibility of flesh is greater here than in some countries, less than in others.
Honestly, if you happen to have curtains or blinds, I don't understand why anybody would sit there naked or half naked and with the curtains open. Unlike some nations, this is clearly not a nation that condones people displaying their body parts (unless the person is a very attractive female appearing in an advertising campaign or music video). In my old apartment I had this young white couple who used to fuck and then sit around naked smoking right in the window and totally visible from my kitchen window. They had blinds - but didn't see fit to use them. I had no blinds at that time. I thought the couple were actually getting a sexual charge out of being watched. I had to immediately invest in some blinds for my window just so I wouldn't have to look at this couple's abundant flabby flesh while brewing my morning coffee.Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
i walk around butt naked with the curtains wide open all the time. at the old place in park slope, the lady and i sed to have a giant window which constituted half of the bedroom wall facing the back, and the other buildings behind us. it had no curtain, and we would have crazy wild sex with the lights on, the neighbors definitely got a show. i could care less if somebody sees my junk. i'm proud of it. i love being naked.Drink good beer.
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Yuck.Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
mypasswordwontwork » [quote="doctorj"]I don't think it's particularly an African thing, .
I'm confused. Is the implication that African people like their curtains closed or that Black Americans like their curtains closed? Obviously those are some vastly different cultures and "African" obviously encompasses everything from Moroccan to Maasai to to Egyptian to Senegalese.... all cultures that are very distinct from Black American culture.[/quote] As in I doubt curtain-closing is exclusively restricted to people with strongly pigmented skin and having ancestors from tropical Africa within the last 500 years. Nor overwhelmingly prevalent among such peoples, whether US citizens or Maasai or Somalian refugees living in Iceland. However I imagine that a combination of 1) recent habitation of more tropical lattitudes and 2) certain puritanical religious traditions could combine to foster a culture of curtain closing. And that curtain opening or a complete lack of window dressing may be more widespread among the impious peoples of the subartic. At least, that's where I learned the habit, as I certainly didn't grow up with it.The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln -
I am definitely a curtain person. I lived in one apartment that had 12ft ceilings and 8ft windows and I did not have any curtains in my living room. But the house was on the second floor on the top of a hill and the closest neighbor was the federal building a block and a half away. Now, I keep my curtains (and shutters) closed at night and when I am prancing around au natural. To combat the light issue I have a sheer translucent fabric that lets the light in, but prevents people from seeing my milkshake, cupcakes, and any other goodies that might decide to make an appearance. I say curtains for all. Why? Because most of the world is not attractive naked.
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Neighbors---I wrote "people of African descent" in my original post. Somehow, that got translated into "African" people by Doctorj. By african descent, I mean black people. Carribean, african-american, african...whatever. Black people. Black folks like to have curtains. White folks don't like to have curtains. I happen to be a black person who doesn't like curtains. I prefer the natural light. The thing is, most of my neighbors DO have blinds, curtains, etc., so they can't see me streaking anyway.
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But I am a white person who likes curtains! Windows look bare without them. I like to open them to let light in but I close them at night. Actually I now have these sort of "privacy blinds" that let light in, but don't allow people to see in. I think this might be another one of those things where people in a very crowded place put up barriers to preserve a sense of personal space, psychologically. If you're living practically on top of thousands of other people, it's nice to feel like you have your own space. But, uh, obviously other people feel differently.
"Now if every newspaper editor had to deal with a reader like Emily, boy, would they think twice, or three times." --greg -
impious peoples of the subartic
while shades will keep a room cool in the summer, they can also help keep a room warm in the winter (by providing a small amount of insulation). maybe we're looking at this the wrong way. i grew up in the suburbs where you don't need to shut your shades because of the distance between buildings and trees in between. whenever i was being a lazy kid, i wouldn't, but it was drilled into me enough by my father that i do it now. he's not a person "of African descent," but he did grow up in the projects in philly, so maybe that's where he learned it. or maybe it just comes from his parents, maybe this is an east coast exhibitionist white people problem, and midwestern gaelo-germans (my grandparents) share a desire for privacy. so here's the question, all you naked folk: are you teenage rock'nroll rebels who never grew up and put on pants, or did you grow up in a frakkin barn.I've done a lot of lying in my time. I've lied to men who wear belts. I've lied to men who wear suspenders. But I'd never be so stupid as to lie to a man who wears both belt and suspenders. -
I'm a white person who wouldn't dream of not having curtains and blinds on every window. Grew up in semi-suburban Michigan, amongst mostly white people, where people closed their shades and curtains in the evening.
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I admit that my "white people don't like curtains, black people like curtains" statement was a sweeping generalization, BUT, I'm just callin' like it see it 'round here....Since the influx of new people in the neighborhood, i've seen lots of un-curtained windows...especially where i live on St. Johns place.
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Are they younger people? I'm thinking that maybe it's a not-so-long-out-of-college aesthetic, as opposed to the way families or established oldsters would decorate.
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It could also be that the curtainless new neighbors haven't had a chance to get curtain rods & curtains. I remember it being a last priority when I moved into my place. There were bigger new apartment things to deal with - like buying a bed. Ikea makes great sheer curtains that are about $10 each. They let lots of light in and provide a bit of a nudity screen from (or for) your neighbors.
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bobbybrummel »
That's what high quality double glazing is for, at least in the day time. At night, you're right, without shades you're losing some extra heat by infrared radiation. For maximum heat trapping efficiency, color your shades black on one side and white on the other, and install an electronic timer with ephemeris and a motor to rotate them once the sun is exactly 12 degrees below the horizon, at the onset of astronomical twighlight. Then sell the product in Skymall. Round here though we have to leave the heaters off and the windows ajar anyhow all winter, or we'd be broiled alive.impious peoples of the subarctic
while shades will keep a room cool in the summer, they can also help keep a room warm in the winter (by providing a small amount of insulation).The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln -
em » It could also be that the curtainless new neighbors haven't had a chance to get curtain rods & curtains. I remember it being a last priority when I moved into my place.
That seems to be true for a lot of people, but I would always put something over the windows right away, even if it was a sheet.doctorj » Round here though we have to leave the heaters off and the windows ajar anyhow all winter, or we'd be broiled alive.
Same here, I have to keep my living room window open, sometimes even with a fan in it. Fortunately my bedroom has its own, cooler microclimate. -
doctorj » Round here though we have to leave the heaters off and the windows ajar anyhow all winter, or we'd be broiled alive.
it was like that in my apartment when it was still 50 degrees out, but i think i complained abuot my room being 88 degrees too much, because now we only seem to get a little heat in the late morning, and much of the night it's 65 degrees. but that's 60 degrees between my shade and the window!I've done a lot of lying in my time. I've lied to men who wear belts. I've lied to men who wear suspenders. But I'd never be so stupid as to lie to a man who wears both belt and suspenders. -
Subject: Re: alright, dude, i can see your penis... (butler pl!)
Take the pictures, but don't post them here...post them on the front door of dudes building.crustythor » the madness at 14-20 butler has got to stop! ever since they renovated the buildings, all of the families who used to live there have moved and out they've been replaced by young, post-college types who have parties on the roof til 5 am, have ridiculous photoshoots and interpretive dance rehearsals up there, and now - the attack of the penis! i live on the top floor of my building on st. john's, and the buildings my apt faces are lower - only 4 floors. we have curtains, but don't freak out about it unless someone's on the roof or something. but the new people in the top floor apartment on butler across from my apartment? they couldn't care less who can see them. right now, as i type, dude is laying naked on top of the covers on a bed right next to the window, with his junk all flappin' in the breeze. i can't even imagine the view my downstairs neighbors have, as they're RIGHT ACROSS from him. i had gotten used to seeing the girl who lives there lounging in her underwear on her laptop, but this full-frontal shit has got to stop. so, suggestions? really, i'm so temtped to post a picture.
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I gotta say, I've been watching this thread all day and cannot stop laughing. Well done everyone. Some interesting theories about how race and latitude relate to window dressings. Not sure how much I buy into any of your theories, except maybe the one about young people new to the nabe being too poor/lazy to put up curtains. However, that certainly doesn't account for the dude naked on the rooftop, or for the girl topless at her computer. Really the thing I'm taking away from all this is surprise at how many of you admit to streaking around your apartments with little regard for the windows. Hey, more power to you -- if I didn't have roommates I might be doing the same. But with the curtains drawn. This show ain't free.
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RBG » Black folks like to have curtains. White folks don't like to have curtains. I happen to be a black person who doesn't like curtains. I prefer the natural light.
That's what I'm saying. Whenever I go home, the moment the sun goes down, my mom starts buggin out about shutting the curtains, and I'm from the suburbs of michigan where everyones houses are yards apart... but black folks DO want their curtains. Sometimes I forget to shut my curtains at night. I'm sure my neighbors have seen me naked plenty of times. But I try to remember to shut them first thing when I get home... i think that my mothers habits rubbed off on me. But I always have them open during the day! Natural light is a must!!my beat is correct. -
laura » I'm a white person who wouldn't dream of not having curtains and blinds on every window. Grew up in semi-suburban Michigan, amongst mostly white people, where people closed their shades and curtains in the evening.
whoa! i just read this after i just posted! so maybe it's a suburban michigan thing!!!!my beat is correct. -
god lord, people, the reason i stopped posting here for so long is that this board just CANNOT fail to turn any issue into a race issue. maybe next we can argue about which coffee shop the naked dude goes to the most? anyway, i'm sure it's more of a just-graduated-from-college, don't-give-a-damn kind of thing than anything...which was the point of my original post. after the "band" photoshoot with the topless dudes in skullcaps and jeans with the knees intentionally torn out; the interpretative dance rehearsals; the hootie and the blowfish and drunken frat talk 'til 5am - this was my last straw with the new wave of residents at 14 and 20 butler...thanks for the eyefull, chunky. i guess the upshot is that the window framed the dude's body just so i could only see him from neck down, so i didn't actually see his face. i won't have to pass him on the sidewalk and smirk at the thought of his junk.
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crustythor » god lord, people, the reason i stopped posting here for so long is that this board just CANNOT fail to turn any issue into a race issue.
And a bit of showy, stilted academic theorizing thrown in just for good measure. Rather comical ... or maybe just very sad. -
I think it would be too scary for certain people to admit that blacks and whites actually have more similarities than differences. So, we continue to just stress the differences, all the timeDo you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
mypasswordwontwork » I think it would be too scary for certain people to admit that blacks and whites actually have more similarities than differences. So, we continue to just stress the differences, all the time
And insinuating that people are racist because they don't recognize a picture of Big Daddy Kane really helps, I'm sure. -
crustythor » the hootie and the blowfish and drunken frat talk 'til 5am
This is the most inexcusable offense, in my opinion. Hootie and the Blowfish? Still?? Lordy. -
laura » [quote="mypasswordwontwork"]I think it would be too scary for certain people to admit that blacks and whites actually have more similarities than differences. So, we continue to just stress the differences, all the time
And insinuating that people are racist because they don't recognize a picture of Big Daddy Kane really helps, I'm sure.[/quote] It's interesting how telling people's responses to ambiguous statements can be! I never said that it was racist to not recognize Big Daddy Kane and it is very interesting indeed that you interpreted my comment in that way!Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
mypasswordwontwork » It's interesting how telling people's responses to ambiguous statements can be! I never said that it was racist to not recognize Big Daddy Kane and it is very interesting indeed that you interpreted my comment in that way!
I interpreted it that way because it seems to me you have a history of assuming racism in others, and making "innocent" statements that are not so very. If I'm wrong, correct me. What was your meaning? Why would you be surprised that people didn't recognize it? (Fwiw, I remembered seeing the photo, but couldn't place a name.) I mean, you didn't recognize Little Edie Beale. So what? Different cultural universes. Why make a sniffy remark about how you're not surprised no-one on this board recognized him? -
ProspectPlaceGirl » whoa! i just read this after i just posted! so maybe it's a suburban michigan thing!!!!
Completely anecdotally, it seems to me that people from the Northern Midwest are more than averagely concerned with modesty. I wonder if there's a connection with colonization by Lutherans in the 19th century: all the modest Germans and Scandinavians moved to the Midwest in search of a more private, better draped life, leaving those countries in the godless, modesty-depleted, uncurtained condition for which they're now renowned.The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln -
doctorj » Completely anecdotally, it seems to me that people from the Northern Midwest are more than averagely concerned with modesty. I wonder if there's a connection with colonization by Lutherans in the 19th century: all the modest Germans and Scandinavians moved to the Midwest in search of a more private, better draped life, leaving those countries in the godless, modesty-depleted, uncurtained condition for which they're now renowned.
Dude, loosen up a bit.
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laura » [quote="mypasswordwontwork"]It's interesting how telling people's responses to ambiguous statements can be! I never said that it was racist to not recognize Big Daddy Kane and it is very interesting indeed that you interpreted my comment in that way!
I interpreted it that way because it seems to me you have a history of assuming racism in others, and making "innocent" statements that are not so very. If I'm wrong, correct me. What was your meaning? [/quote] I meant that the majority of people who frequent this board seemed unlikely - IMO - to know much about hip-hop. That is all.Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
Anyway race aside, I think it's disrespectful to your neighbors to prance around naked and fuck when you KNOW that your neighbors and your neighbors' kids could see you. How long does it take to draw a fucking curtain??? I just don't get it! It's one thing if you live in a house in its own land but in NYC we largely live very very close to one another and it's time to get some curtains and use them.Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
laura » Dude, loosen up a bit.
I'm a little concerned that you may not be taking me seriously. The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln -
mypasswordwontwork » I meant that the majority of people who frequent this board seemed unlikely - IMO - to know much about hip-hop. That is all.
Just speaking for myself, I like quite a great deal of hip-hop (mostly old school tho). I wouldn't make assumptions about other people - I mean, I just don't know what other people listen to. So I'm curious as to why you would make such an assumption. -
Most people who really know their old school hip-hop would instantly recognize a picture of Big Daddy Kane. Just sayin' Do you know where you're going to
Do you like the things that life is showing you?
Diana Ross -
mypasswordwontwork » Most people who really know their old school hip-hop would instantly recognize a picture of Big Daddy Kane. Just sayin'
I've got tons of music by people I wouldn't instantly recognize a photograph of. And my old hip-hop collection was copied from cassettes in the 80s. -
doctorj » [quote="laura"] Dude, loosen up a bit.
I'm a little concerned[/quote] Ooh, very Tim Gunn, you just won points in my book. doctorj » that you may not be taking me seriously.
I just think that in this particular discussion Occam's Razor wins the day (people who just moved in haven't bought curtains yet) and your erudition strikes me as a tad stiff and out of place. But maybe I'm just not in the mood to think about Lutherans in the 19th century on a Friday night. But why would you care what I think anyway? (I mean that insouciantly, not combatively) -
I always wonder who's going to market Occam's Razor first, Bic or Gillette...?...not that there's anything wrong with that.
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WhyFi » I always wonder who's going to market Occam's Razor first, Bic or Gillette...?
Ain't gonna happen ... you have to have at LEAST three blades these days. -
i think that this is the best post in the PH boards ever.my beat is correct.
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