Forgive me if this has already been discussed (I am new to the board), but what is up with the guy who is always asking for money in front of Ace Supermarket on Berkeley and 7th? He seems to be friends with everyone! So many people stop by to chat with him. I wonder...does he really need to be asking for money?
Flexichick Windsor Terrorist
Joined: 27 Apr 2006 Posts: 9623
Wed May 17, 06 3:52 pm EST
I'm sure he just does it because it's fun. I mean, that's what I do when I'm bored. Don't you?
armchair_warrior retsop cixelsyd
Joined: 23 Dec 2005 Posts: 5800 Location: boondocks
Wed May 17, 06 3:57 pm EST
from what i read many years back. these guys make more money than the average guy. _________________ Fight white guilt and injustice by going to a Native American casino and gamble your money away.
Joined: 26 Jul 2005 Posts: 283 Location: Union & 8th
Wed May 17, 06 4:21 pm EST
armchair_warrior wrote:
from what i read many years back. these guys make more money than the average guy.
That's gotta be one of the more annoying urban myths. There may be a small handful of uber-successful panhandlers in NYC, but I highly doubt that most make more than a handful of dollars per day. To suggest otherwise is ludicrous and even slightly offensive.
Although, this guy is somewhat suspect - I don't know him at all, so all of this is pure conejcture and speculation, but I'm almost 100% positive he's not homeless - once when I was going to citibank to use the ATM, he was opening the door for people and a young kid (about 10 or 12 yrs old) came up to him and said "she wants you at home - NOW". I've also seen the guy drinkning what looked like cappucinos from Ozzies. I think he's just someone with low-income who is looking to get some spending money.
sterling2000 CIO, Outdated Theatrics, Inc.
Joined: 22 Jun 2005 Posts: 594 Location: The intersection of Blight Street and Gentrification Avenue.
Wed May 17, 06 4:36 pm EST
A Brooklyn magazine did a cover interview/profile on the guy a few years back...can't remember details now...too many beers from Ace from when I was living on Berkeley.
(An aside about Ace: those guys are super nice. I was in there a couple times a day a few years back. When the blackout hit a couple summers ago, they manned the store from the front door. I had no cash, but they gave me batteries, beer and cigarettes (just the esseentials, please) on my word. I paid them back the next day. Even though I'm in PH now, they always remember me, ask about my kids, etc....) _________________ "The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon
Guest
Wed May 17, 06 4:47 pm EST
the fact that he is a "famous" homeless person tells alot. most of the people who give him money and talk to him like he is everyone's best friend are probably the same people who look the other way when others ask for money on the sidewalks, subways, etc.
stacey Beyond Karma
Joined: 01 Mar 2005 Posts: 3105 Location: Underhill Ave.
Wed May 17, 06 5:04 pm EST
daniel wrote:
That's gotta be one of the more annoying urban myths. There may be a small handful of uber-successful panhandlers in NYC, but I highly doubt that most make more than a handful of dollars per day. To suggest otherwise is ludicrous and even slightly offensive.
Sorry I disagree Daniel - I have seen plenty of panhandlers in the Wall Street area, where, while standing outside for about 10-15 minutes 6 or 7 brokers will hand her/him $5 at at time, add to that the miscellaneous dollars that are handed out by others just walking by.
Some of these panhandlers are wearing "new" sneakers that cost more than my whole outfit.
One woman would sit outside near the Stock Exchange with her young (maybe 1-2 year old) child. I always gave her $ because I felt sorry for her. Guess where I saw her about 3 months ago - she was in Macys purchasing a Coach bag!!!! I would not have recognized her except her son recognized me and waved hello.
Im not saying that they are making thousands of dollars but I do think that a lot are making at least $30-40 a day.
escap expatriated
Joined: 06 Jul 2005 Posts: 1189
Wed May 17, 06 5:20 pm EST
I went to elementary school in Park Slope and that guy has been there since then (early 1980s), at least. He's a neighborhood staple.
findcate Local
Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 243 Location: park slope
Wed May 17, 06 5:30 pm EST
i always give him money. i hate seeing older people on the street, it is just wrong. with the recent legislation on retirement accounts, more people might find themselves in his shoes--better start saving! he turned 61 on sunday. I don't know much more than that, but i don't think he's suspect.
Flexichick Windsor Terrorist
Joined: 27 Apr 2006 Posts: 9623
Wed May 17, 06 5:37 pm EST
I occasionally give him money, but I have bought him some pizza and that seemed to make him happy.
I've never seen him bothering anybody and I know all too well that it doesn't take much these days to end up in a bad financial or living situation.
kensingtonmom Guest
Wed May 17, 06 5:37 pm EST
stacey wrote:
Im not saying that they are making thousands of dollars but I do think that a lot are making at least $30-40 a day.
Last time I checked $9,000/year was well below the poverty line and would definitely keep you homeless. So if you lived on the street and couldn't afford rent, then you would have money for a coach bag or a pair of sneakers or the drug of your choice. We might not approve of those choices, but if you are making them, then you are probably mentally ill or a drug addict. It certainly isn't a great lifestyle choice!! And it is easy to justify ignoring someone by saying: oh they make a lot of money doing this, and they are just going to spend it and not save towards a downpayment on a coop. I am not being self-righteous, I am guilty of it too.
armchair_warrior retsop cixelsyd
Joined: 23 Dec 2005 Posts: 5800 Location: boondocks
Wed May 17, 06 5:54 pm EST
doesnt matter what he is homeless or not. i hear tons of diffrent stories from these type of guys. once i was walking my ex to a store. guy came up to us, telling us that he just lost his job. few hrs later he came to us again and told us that he a diffrent story. I told him like dude you told me this few hrs ago. he just laugh and walk away. and than we saw him again later that night buying brooze from store. same simillar story with some guy claiming he doesnt have money to ride the train home. me and my ex barely had money to buy food that day. later on saw the guy eating out in the area buying food and we gave him our last few bucks. anyway after so many times like that. i just stop giving alot of jerk offs pretending to be poor or had no money. _________________ Fight white guilt and injustice by going to a Native American casino and gamble your money away.
Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 4389 Location: In the Groove
Wed May 17, 06 6:42 pm EST
This subject (panhandling income potential) was discussed previously here.
In addition to some info that I'd found in a Denver, CO study, I think that this is telling-
Cathleen wrote:
Well...here's a little bit of hard evidence:
My husband works for a bank in TriBeCa, and one of his customers is a young girl that panhandles. He works for the bank that has those free coin counters, so she dumps all the change she makes all day in them, and then makes a deposit. She regularly deposits $200 a day!
_________________ ...not that there's anything wrong with that.
sterling2000 CIO, Outdated Theatrics, Inc.
Joined: 22 Jun 2005 Posts: 594 Location: The intersection of Blight Street and Gentrification Avenue.
Wed May 17, 06 10:09 pm EST
As with all panhandlers, whatever personal guilt or jag you get off by giving away your hard-earned money ... it only encourages them.
There are a number of "homeless" "panhandlers" on 7th who are very sweet and very polite, often playing on the local demographic guilt and speaking to the kids in strollers with kind words. Since my kid was a baby I've told him they are what they truly are, not some modern euphemism but bums, hobos, derelicts and deadbeats. I have zero respect for those who won't even pick up a shovel to earn some money (as I did starting at age 12).
Particularly within the political context of today with all the pressure on illegals, I have a greater respect for those who are willing to put their backs and sweat into earning an honest wage rather than pushing a frankly insultingly dishonest handout with a shuffle, eye roll and toothy smile.
I walked through Park Slope today on a day off and saw a number of people using jackhammers, hauling debris, toting wheel barrows, planting shrubs, hauling 5-gallon buckets of cement, etc. (all jobs I did at some point).
I nod and smile to these people.
I sneer at those with but an empty palm extended with a grin.
Only give to these people if you seek to devalue your own labors. _________________ "The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon
kensingtonmom Guest
Wed May 17, 06 10:40 pm EST
sterling2000 wrote:
nod and smile to these people.
I sneer at those with but an empty palm extended with a grin. .
Ouch. Whatever happened to compassion? Even the empty words "compassionate conservative"? Many people cannot pull themselves up by their bootstraps because they are mentally ill. Plain and simple. We put them on the streets and then sneer at them when they beg.
sterling2000 CIO, Outdated Theatrics, Inc.
Joined: 22 Jun 2005 Posts: 594 Location: The intersection of Blight Street and Gentrification Avenue.
Wed May 17, 06 10:54 pm EST
kensingtonmom wrote:
Even the empty words "compassionate conservative"?
Agreed that the concept is empty spin.
My political leanings are very liberal, realistic and especially pragmatic (this is why I support a practical approach to life in hard work and thought). However, liberal thought doesn't mean accepting everything off the grid nor does it mean automatically accepting the lowest common denominator. This opposite line of supported thinking is one of the contributing reasons to why Dems can't win elections now.
And, I do not suffer fools nor those who seek to make a fool of me or my children. _________________ "The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon
WhyFi Staid and Dull
Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 4389 Location: In the Groove
Wed May 17, 06 10:56 pm EST
kensingtonmom wrote:
Many people cannot pull themselves up by their bootstraps because they are mentally ill.
Many, and maybe even most... but not the ones that we're talking about. We're talking about the career panhandlers that are fixtures at certain high-traffic locations - outside of the stores on 7th Ave or Flatbush... strategically placed to collect the change from your purchase before you can put it in your pocket... the ones with no obvious mental or physical limitations... the ones with the clean and not-at-all-threadbare clothing... those are the ones that we're talking about. _________________ ...not that there's anything wrong with that.
Flexichick Windsor Terrorist
Joined: 27 Apr 2006 Posts: 9623
Wed May 17, 06 11:02 pm EST
Holy crap, what a topic!
If you want to give, give. If you don't, don't.
Making huge generalizations about who these people are and what their situation is is absurd!
Of course some are scammers, but some are not.
If you want to give something to somebody but don't know if they're in serious need - buy a meal, or bring your leftovers from dinner out (since god knows the portions are large enough).
sterling2000 CIO, Outdated Theatrics, Inc.
Joined: 22 Jun 2005 Posts: 594 Location: The intersection of Blight Street and Gentrification Avenue.
Wed May 17, 06 11:07 pm EST
Flexichick wrote:
If you want to give something to somebody but don't know if they're in serious need - buy a meal, or bring your leftovers from dinner out (since god knows the portions are large enough).
This is a good idea, not just for the altruism but as a scam-buster.
I've given food before, occasionally with a positive reaction, but more often with a negative confrontation. This truly parses the honest minority from the more common hucksters. _________________ "The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon
escap expatriated
Joined: 06 Jul 2005 Posts: 1189
Wed May 17, 06 11:39 pm EST
On a slightly different note, I always wondered how that guy got claim to that turf in the first place. I mean, he's been there for literally decades, without any notable intruders or competition that I've ever seen, and that is some prime panhandling real estate. Normally I'd guess that he kicked someone's ass to claim turf rights, but that guy really doesn't strike me as that ass kicking type--more likely he'd be on the losing end. So why hasn't anyone ever challenged him? Is the homeless community so oblivious to the goldmine that is 7th and Berkeley? That guy has literally lived his lifetime on the generosity of the PS community. Hey, he may be lazy but he is smart.
Guest
Thu May 18, 06 12:31 am EST
sterling2000 wrote:
A Brooklyn magazine did a cover interview/profile on the guy a few years back...can't remember details now...too many beers from Ace from when I was living on Berkeley.
(An aside about Ace: those guys are super nice. I was in there a couple times a day a few years back. When the blackout hit a couple summers ago, they manned the store from the front door. I had no cash, but they gave me batteries, beer and cigarettes (just the esseentials, please) on my word. I paid them back the next day. Even though I'm in PH now, they always remember me, ask about my kids, etc....)
The magazine is called Stay Free. You can get it at Brooklyn Industries. Anyway, the guys seems to be very nice. You may be able to find the interview online at - www.stayfreemagazine.org/.
Guest
Thu May 18, 06 10:28 am EST
What is with the guy who has an eye patch on Flatbush and 7th?
Drano Meow Wars Veteran
Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Posts: 1559
Thu May 18, 06 10:51 am EST
All I can say is that a hobo and a bum are two different things.
findcate Local
Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 243 Location: park slope
Thu May 18, 06 11:05 am EST
"I've given food before, occasionally with a positive reaction, but more often with a negative confrontation. This truly parses the honest minority from the more common hucksters."
I wouldn't want to eat someone else's leftovers either, eeew.
sterling2000 CIO, Outdated Theatrics, Inc.
Joined: 22 Jun 2005 Posts: 594 Location: The intersection of Blight Street and Gentrification Avenue.
Thu May 18, 06 11:05 am EST
Drano wrote:
All I can say is that a hobo and a bum are two different things.
Good point. As a longtime fan of Woody Guthrie, I should have made a finer point there.
:-) _________________ "The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon
Drano Meow Wars Veteran
Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Posts: 1559
Thu May 18, 06 12:17 pm EST
sterling2000 wrote:
Drano wrote:
All I can say is that a hobo and a bum are two different things.
Good point. As a longtime fan of Woody Guthrie, I should have made a finer point there.
:-)
Well, my grandfather went out of his way to make that point to me when I was a kid - I don't know exactly how that conversation started but obviously I remembered the important stuff...
Flexichick Windsor Terrorist
Joined: 27 Apr 2006 Posts: 9623
Thu May 18, 06 1:48 pm EST
"I wouldn't want to eat someone else's leftovers either, eeew."
Well, if it mean the difference between eating anything or nothing, you might feel differently.
Livetotravel Rent Stabilized
Joined: 11 Nov 2005 Posts: 1630 Location: A block from the Park
Thu May 18, 06 2:19 pm EST
Pretty sure the panhandler is out there just trying to supplement his income after having bought his first co-op in PS back in the Reagan 80's.
Hey - those maintenace fees are damn high! _________________ But that's impossible.
Joined: 01 Mar 2005 Posts: 3105 Location: Underhill Ave.
Thu May 18, 06 2:21 pm EST
kensingtonmom wrote:
stacey wrote:
Im not saying that they are making thousands of dollars but I do think that a lot are making at least $30-40 a day.
Last time I checked $9,000/year was well below the poverty line and would definitely keep you homeless. So if you lived on the street and couldn't afford rent, then you would have money for a coach bag or a pair of sneakers or the drug of your choice. We might not approve of those choices, but if you are making them, then you are probably mentally ill or a drug addict. It certainly isn't a great lifestyle choice!! And it is easy to justify ignoring someone by saying: oh they make a lot of money doing this, and they are just going to spend it and not save towards a downpayment on a coop. I am not being self-righteous, I am guilty of it too.
I didn't say they were raking in the dough - not that they should use my money to purchase a home - my point was to explain that they are making the same amount as some people who work at a minium wage job and pay taxes.
I still feel that if you have a young child asking people for money to feed your child and then purchasing a $300 bag allows me to ignore you the next time you ask for money and it is frustrating to me because the only one suffering is that child. As a mother I am sure you can understand my frustration.
Guestpks Guest
Thu May 18, 06 4:35 pm EST
Wow. Who knew my original post would spark such an interesting discussion.
Here's the deal on why I posted in the first place:
1. Panhandlers - anywhere - affect the appearance, safety level, and the true and perceived socio-economic status of any given location.
2. I pay a LOT of rent to live in the North Slope because I like that it is a) safe b) nice looking (that's right - like when my parents come over I would like them to know that I live in a pretty, affluent neighborhood), and c) I am of the "sterling2000" opinion that "...I have a greater respect for those who are willing to put their backs and sweat into earning an honest wage rather than pushing a frankly insultingly dishonest handout with a shuffle, eye roll and toothy smile."
3. I don't like being asked for money by a panhandler who has a home, decent clothes, is not starving, and has - let me be very clear - GOOD FRIENDS who chat with him and give him money EVERYDAY. This is not an experience I enjoy on my daily commute to Manhattan from my nice, extremely expensive neighborhood.
1 + 2 + 3 = why that guy irritates me.
There. I said it. Let the flames begin. Unless, of course, some of you feel the same way but were afraid to say it because it's so darn un-PC.
WhyFi Staid and Dull
Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 4389 Location: In the Groove
Thu May 18, 06 5:23 pm EST
Of course they're irritating- they bug the shit out of me. I personally don't find it un-PC to say that a panhandler that's mentally and physically able to hold a job is an annoyance that I'd rather not deal with... _________________ ...not that there's anything wrong with that.
findcate Local
Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 243 Location: park slope
Thu May 18, 06 5:27 pm EST
i hate poor people. if i stand next to them, people might think i am poor too. we should round em up and ship em all off somewhere.
Guestpks: i think the funniest bit of that posting was that you want your parents to think you live in an affluent neighborhood. just curious, why? are they from CT by any chance? my mom is and I could live anywhere in NYC and she'd still think it was sketchy...because she's basically a stepford wife.
kosherdave The Kosherist
Joined: 17 Jan 2006 Posts: 988
Thu May 18, 06 5:38 pm EST
My old roommate works in mental health and housing, he finds places for homeless people to live. When he sees people begging for money on the subway or everywhere else, he hands them a card to where they can get help. Sure, there is a stigma about going to get help, but it's not as bad as shuffling your feet. My point is, for the large amount of cards he hands out, it sounds like very few people seek help. It's easier to beg than try to better your life. And I am talking mentally ill too, his housing is for everyone. So, next time someone asks you for a penny,dime, quarter, whatever the robotic spiel, tell them where they can get some real help. Giving them money only keeps them in a state of constant needing and begging.
Kensingtonmom Guest
Thu May 18, 06 5:53 pm EST
Guestpks wrote:
1. Panhandlers - anywhere - affect the appearance, safety level, and the true and perceived socio-economic status of any given location.
2. I pay a LOT of rent to live in the North Slope because I like that it is a) safe b) nice looking (that's right - like when my parents come over I would like them to know that I live in a pretty, affluent neighborhood), and c) I am of the "sterling2000" opinion that "...I have a greater respect for those who are willing to put their backs and sweat into earning an honest wage rather than pushing a frankly insultingly dishonest handout with a shuffle, eye roll and toothy smile."
There. I said it. Let the flames begin. Unless, of course, some of you feel the same way but were afraid to say it because it's so darn un-PC.
It is a sad reflection of what Park Slope has become. I just don't understand the harshness towards someone asking for some change for God's sakes?? CHANGE! You can't even get a cup of latte with that pile of change. And of course you can just walk by, they aren't shaking the change out of your pockets. Having done some volunteer work for Coalition for the Homeless, I can tell you that the majority are either substance abusers or mentally ill. Our government turned them on to the streets by cutting programs and with no hand to help them up and off the street. The compassionate conservatives asked us to shoulder the responsibility and I guess we did so by being disgusted and wanting them removed. Wow, I just find this very disturbing.
I think Guestpks you should be more concerned what your mother thinks of your cold heart--as a mother I am more concerned that my sons grow up to be kind towards the less fortunate and not that they wear name brand clothes and live in a name brand neighborhood.
findcate Local
Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 243 Location: park slope
Thu May 18, 06 6:00 pm EST
Right Kensingtonmom!!
Guestpks: I actually don't think PS is that impressive anyway...it's nice but if you want to impress someone you should get one of those brownstones across from the Met.
WhyFi Staid and Dull
Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 4389 Location: In the Groove
Thu May 18, 06 6:05 pm EST
Kensingtonmom wrote:
It is a sad reflection of what Park Slope has become. I just don't understand the harshness towards someone asking for some change for God's sakes?? CHANGE! You can't even get a cup of latte with that pile of change. And of course you can just walk by, they aren't shaking the change out of your pockets. Having done some volunteer work for Coalition for the Homeless, I can tell you that the majority are either substance abusers or mentally ill. .
Do you really not understand the people that we're talking about? Yes, the majority of the homeless are mentally ill, we get that... and we're not talking about them. We're talking about the people that panhandle simply because it's easier to take advantage of the generosity of others than it is to earn a living.
PS- several times a year, I deposit close to $100 in change. Change does add up, you need only ask a career panhandler. _________________ ...not that there's anything wrong with that.
armchair_warrior retsop cixelsyd
Joined: 23 Dec 2005 Posts: 5800 Location: boondocks
Thu May 18, 06 6:05 pm EST
we should send them all the alaska to a labor work camp. alaska needs labor and we have a surplus panhandling population! that or san fran which ever is cheaper. _________________ Fight white guilt and injustice by going to a Native American casino and gamble your money away.
Joined: 10 Nov 2005 Posts: 911 Location: South Slope
Thu May 18, 06 6:08 pm EST
I think I am a compassionate person but I very rarely give money to panhandlers. When I first moved to NYC from the suburbs, I would give money to anyone who asked for it, because I thought of how desperate I would have to be to approach a stranger for money. Then I moved to an apartment building in the East Village where panhandlers hung out on the stoop and after getting hassled every time I went in or out of my building I definitely lost some of my compassion or at least my naivete and I decided to donate a set amount of money each month to charity rather than give money to panhandlers. So that's what I do.
I also remember that several years ago there were arrests of a couple of men who were robbing houses and apartments in Park Slope -- it turned out that they were regular 7th Avenue panhandlers who were begging for money during the day and committing robberies at night. I have a vague recollection that another panhandler "regular" from 7th Ave was convicted of rape. So, I don't know what I'm saying -- I guess, that some of them are probably nice people who have fallen on hard times and are deserving of compassion and handouts, and others are not -- and I personally do not have the ability to distinguish so I would prefer to donate to charities that presumably have the resources to direct money to those who really need it most.
kensingtonmom Guest
Thu May 18, 06 6:36 pm EST
WhyFi wrote:
Do you really not understand the people that we're talking about? Yes, the majority of the homeless are mentally ill, we get that... and we're not talking about them. We're talking about the people that panhandle simply because it's easier to take advantage of the generosity of others than it is to earn a living.
PS- several times a year, I deposit close to $100 in change. Change does add up, you need only ask a career panhandler.
I get it. I know who you are talking about. What bothers me is the blanket attitudes towards being annoyed by homeless people that some people are expressing. They don't look pretty standing on a street corner blocking the view to the Corcoran windows. Yes, they obviously can be an annoyance--all I am saying is don't justify your disgust with ridiculous statements that they are living a good life on $9000 a year or what not. You can justify any base emotion or prejudice. And yes, some homeless people do commit crimes, and that is why we need programs to get some of these people help and OFF the streets.
findcate Local
Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 243 Location: park slope
Thu May 18, 06 6:41 pm EST
some homeless people commit crimes, but some wealthy people commit crimes too--like lying to start a war that has resulted in 2454 dead US soldiers and between 34-38,000 dead iraqi civilians (innocent civilians). i'm more worried about that than panhandlers. we should ship the residents of the white house off to alaska first, then worry about the guy on 7th ave.
WhyFi Staid and Dull
Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 4389 Location: In the Groove
Thu May 18, 06 6:46 pm EST
kensingtonmom wrote:
I get it. I know who you are talking about. What bothers me is the blanket attitudes towards being annoyed by homeless people that some people are expressing. They don't look pretty standing on a street corner blocking the view to the Corcoran windows. Yes, they obviously can be an annoyance--all I am saying is don't justify your disgust with ridiculous statements that they are living a good life on $9000 a year or what not. You can justify any base emotion or prejudice. And yes, some homeless people do commit crimes, and that is why we need programs to get some of these people help and OFF the streets.
Who's expressing this blanket attitude towards homeless people? I'll put my lunch money up against yours in a bet that the people that we're expressing an annoyance with aren't homeless. _________________ ...not that there's anything wrong with that.
armchair_warrior retsop cixelsyd
Joined: 23 Dec 2005 Posts: 5800 Location: boondocks
Thu May 18, 06 6:50 pm EST
its not the homless thats the problem its the can work but wont work pandhandle people! _________________ Fight white guilt and injustice by going to a Native American casino and gamble your money away.
Who's expressing this blanket attitude towards homeless people? I'll put my lunch money up against yours in a bet that the people that we're expressing an annoyance with aren't homeless.
How about Guestpks for one?
"1. Panhandlers - anywhere - affect the appearance, safety level, and the true and perceived socio-economic status of any given location."
Rose Ninja
Joined: 10 Nov 2005 Posts: 911 Location: South Slope
Fri May 19, 06 8:48 am EST
findcate wrote:
some wealthy people commit crimes too--like lying to start a war that has resulted in 2454 dead US soldiers and between 34-38,000 dead iraqi civilians (innocent civilians).
Yeah and I wouldn't give that guy any of my money either if I could help it.
WhyFi Staid and Dull
Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 4389 Location: In the Groove
Fri May 19, 06 9:06 am EST
kensingtonmom wrote:
How about Guestpks for one?
"1. Panhandlers - anywhere - affect the appearance, safety level, and the true and perceived socio-economic status of any given location."
a) Panhandler does not necessarily equal homeless. And again-
WhyFi wrote:
I'll put my lunch money up against yours in a bet that the people that we're expressing an annoyance with aren't homeless.
b) ... I don't think that there is really a need for a "b."
How 'bout this- show me where someone expresses this 'blanket attitude' towards the homeless. Show me the quote, and please highlight the word "homeless." You can't, 'cause it's not there.
Don't try to look down on us from your high horse because you naively equate "panhandler" and "homeless." _________________ ...not that there's anything wrong with that.
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