[belzjm]

ok ok...i know some people get sick of the comparisons of new york to europe or other cosmopolitan cities outside the u.s., but after just having come back from vacation abroad yet again, it always strikes me as disappointing to come back home to a dark park slope at 10pm. i realize 5th avenue is a better situation than 7th, but it's so nice to be able to eat a late dinner, stroll around in nice weather, have a coffee, etc. you can walk down streets similar to those in park slope in other cities at 1am on a weeknight and still find people sipping wine, eating, etc. why have we become so uptight here that everything needs to close so early? even the hardware store closes up at like 6 :00 or 6:30 or something. for those of us that work till 6, i can't even make it there on a weekday, and have to wait till the weekend for a small home improvement project.

are there any others out there that feel this way? my idea would be to start encouraging businesses to start their day a little later....shops could open at 11 or 12 instead of 10 and maybe stay open till 8 or 9pm or even 10pm. even the pizza place on 7th and union closes at like 11. i can't get a slice of pizza ANYWHERE nearby coming home a little tipsy. this seems crazy to me.

i just wish we could take a cue from some of the ways those in other countries have the ability to enjoy not only their weekend, but also the weeknights. we should relax a little, and the best way to do this is to enjoy food, drink, shopping, etc. we've got all the great stores here already, the system just needs a little fine tuning in my opinion.

[Brooke Lynn Knight]

I doubt it's "uptightness" that's causing places to close when they do. Tarzian (if that's the hardware store you're referring to) closes at 6 because it's family-run, and the family chooses not to work till all hours. The other places close because the cost of keeping them open late exceeds the expected revenue from late-night business.

Businesses exist to make a profit. If a business thinks there's money in staying open late, they'll do it. Families tend to go inside around the dinner hour and stay there, so many of the local businesses close around then.

As for nightlife, there are all kinds of bars and restaurants open very late on 5th Ave, practically one on every block. How many do you need to hit per night?

If you need food after the bars close, I believe 5th Ave Coffee Shop, New Purity, and a few other coffee shops are open 24 hours.

On the other hand, perhaps you're the one who should "relax a little," and accept this neighborhood and its character as one part of the tapestry of the city. You might be happier seeking out a more swingin' and less "uptight" neighborhood. Unless, of course, you're hunting for MILFs....
_________________
i blame such comments on boredom and drinkng, this is why we need more green spaces
-- Karl the Druid

[pitu]

I feel that way every once in awhile . . .

here's some choices for non-bar hanging out - where the kitchen is open pretty late/they don't chase you out at 10pm:
Long Tan (Fifth Ave and Sackett)
The Sheep Station (4th Ave and Douglass)
Bonnie's Grill serves til midnight on weekends, I think
And Blue Ribbon (Fifth Ave at ...1st St?) serves until 4am, for the staff at all the other places.

also, 9:30p is a great time to get a table at al di la (which is crazy packed earlier)

There must be a few others, no?

[belzjm]

i wasn't expecting a response like that.

thanks for your closed minded thoughts though. clearly you are feeling a bit defensive about the uptight thing. i could have used any number of words, and it wasn't used to describe the people of park slope or you in particular. it was simply to describe the notion that life during the week is for working and not for fun. i believe i said we. try leaving the country and you'll see what i mean. people eat dinner at 10, 11, 12pm, have a drink, talk with friends. not stay inside and watch tv after 6pm.

i wasn't referring to bars, as much as shops and restaurants. and how would these said businesses know it is not financially viable to stay open late if they've never done it? i walked down 7th avenue yesterday on my way home from work and wished i could have popped into a couple places that were already closed or pulling down the gates. that's all i'm sayin.

i'm quite happy in my neighborhood despite my said observation, thank you. you seem to have taken it personally and from your single post, sound like all the gross self centered people that so many seem to complain about our neighborhood. personally i'm glad you're inside from the dinner hour on.

[Livetotravel]

Ah, hello? This is suburban Brooklyn for crying out loud - you know, land of moms and dads and workin' folks - you want all that you wish you had? Then do a balanced comparison - Manhattan is the borough most often compared to European urban centers. So maybe the East Village is what you're looking for? I kinda like the fact that I can actually go to sleep at 11 if I want to without excessive street noise.

[doublediamond]

belzjm, I know what you mean. It's an American thing though to not be out on the streets after evening, unless boozing. I agree with your sentiment: It's not about being in a bar until 1am, but about having a coffee, a pastry, even a glass of wine with friends and the community, relaxing.

It's cultural to America. We're uptight. We work the most hours and aren't even that productive. It's all about the money here in the U.S. Look a life in Brazil for example, where it's taken for granted that one is a part of a wider community and kids are out late with their parents and such.

What you can do is hang with like minded folks and create this type of lifestyle. Maybe it won't be in a cafe but it could be on a rooftop deck, a garden backyard, a stoop, or in front of a roaring fire in the winter. My uncle who lives in Florida did just that. He brought his street together by hosting Friday get togethers, literally by plopping lounge chairs in his driveway, popping open a bottle of champagne, lighting a cigar and beckoning the folks coming home from work over for a glass. Soon, all the adults on his street were coming over on Fridays staying well into the night hanging in the driveway, the garage open, music playing while all their kids played in the street (they lived on a cul de sac). He brings this mentality wherever he goes and his daughter grew up napping in restaurants when the party ran long, or joined in the conversation (much like I did growing up).

Anyway, I digress. This type of mentality won't change in this neighborhood because what you're describing doesn't define our American cities, and many don't want a restaurant or cafe on their block open late.

We have to keep it alive ourselves. I for one am up for hosting some get togethers on my roofdeck and getting to know new people!
_________________
I believe in peace, bitch.

[Livetotravel]

you're kidding right? Have neither of you ever lived in Manhattan? Jesus, that's where 24 hour street life actually exists, at least it did in every neighborhood I lived in.

And just where in the hell can you get at croissant at 4:00 AM in Paris?

[doublediamond]

[belzjm]

thank you for your comments, doublediamond. i completely agree with you. the only reason i brought it up is 1. because i was just in buenos aires, and have been taking european vacations for the previous 4 summers and 2. because my friends and i have all been saying how we think park slope in many ways is quite european except for the fact that it's shuttered up so early. i know it's a fact of american life, but i just thought that perhaps by putting my observations out into cyberspace....well i don't know what i thought. i just wanted to say it because i was thinking it.

i appreciate your comments and agree that for now, i'll continue to carve out my own european lifestyle here in new york. i love new york, i love park slope but i do find this european mentality of a little more fun a little less work quite civilized.

you are absolutely correct about new york not being a 24 hour city. if you want to see a REAL 24 hour city, you should visit buenos aires sometime. what an incredible place....they have about 3 million people compared to our 8 million and the vibrancy and cosmopolitan nature rivals, if not surpasses new york, in my opinion. that's saying a lot given what that city and country have endured over the past decade...

[Livetotravel]

24-hour drug stores:
Duane Reade (24-hour store), 769 Broadway at East 9th St., (646)-602-8274
Duane Reade(24-hour store), 123 3rd Ave. at 14th St., (212)-529-7140
Duane Reade(24-hour store), 24 E. 14th St. at University Place, (212)-989-3632
Walgreen's (24-hour pharmacy), 145 Fourth Avenue at 14th Street, (212) 677-0054
Duane Reade (24-hour store), 378 6th Ave at Waverly Place, 212-674-5357
Duane Reade (24-hour store), 598 Broadway between Houston and Prince, (212)-343-2567
Duane Reade (24-hour store), 180 W 20th St at 7th Ave., (212)-243-0129
CVS (24-hour pharmacy), 342 East 23rd St.

Apple Store
767 Fifth Ave.
Store Hours
24/365

Grocery:
Gristedes 2704 Broadway (103St)
JJ Fresh Produce 300 Albany Street @ South End Avenue
94 Deli & Salad 94 Fulton Street @ William
Broadway New Fancy Food 351 Broadway
Cordato's 94½ Greenwich Street @ Rector
Gourmet Market 450 North End Avenue @ Chambers
Joe's Gourmet 98 Greenwich Street @ Rector
Jubilee Marketplace 99 John Street @ Cliff
Roxy Food Shop 20 John Street @ Nassau

Restaurants - too numerous to list - see link
http://www.menupages.com/restaurants.asp?hours=24

[homeowner]

Doublediamond, I don't know where you lived, but most of my twenties were spent in late night spots around the city. My friends worked at recording studios and clubs and we often would have dinner at midnight or later. I remember when you could go to 8th Street in the Village and every store, head shop, and pizza joint were open for business until well after midnight.

Same thing in Brooklyn. I remember going to the prominade after 10pm and walking along Montague to get ice cream and window shop. Then, every other storefront became a realtor and all of a sudden the place was dark after 6:30pm.

[Nuclear Redaction]

I spent some time in Mexico a couple of years ago and found wonderful street life into the evening in each city and town I visited. In one city, a state-sponsored band played in a public square while people danced or hung out; in another, groups of people would wander the streets and stop wherever they saw people hanging out in a restaurant, square, etc., and launch into song. There were always kids around, and a lot of businesses stayed open late.

That sort of thing is pretty common across the Mediterranean countries and Latin America, but the entire daily schedule there is different from ours -- everything shuts down in the afternoon while people go home for lunch or a nap, and people start their day later, so dinner at 10 and drinking or dancing till 4 a.m. doesn't interfere with the need to be up at 6 a.m. to get to work. Here, everyone has to be up early for work, and at night, between the TV, the fear of having to interact with other people and the need to schedule the kids to within an inch of their lives, there's not a lot of room for wandering the streets or hanging out in the park or cafe.
_________________
To have ambition was my ambition -- Gof4

[doldrums]

well compared to Buenos Aires, even Europe appears shuttered, with the exception of Spain. You're right, that's a great city, although , bear in mind that many of the better restaurants there do not open for dinner until 8:45 pm.

[raw]

I wish spoiled brats would stop whining.

If you think Park Slope's hours suck drive upstate to Albany or Troy where you can't enjoy superb food, comfortable cafes, unique boutiques, stand-up comedy, concerts, or independent films after 7 PM on a weeknight, weekend or EVER. Or go to Boston where EVERYTHING shuts down at midnight. Or try living in Haiti, where people don't even have lights after the sun goes down.

If you want longer hours, you should volunteer to work for free at local businesses in my opinion.
_________________
I blame such comments on beer.
© karlthedruid 2007

[lmboogie]

belzjm:i was reading your post smiling, thinking what a great story to share and happy that you not only had an amazing time on holiday but now sharing what you experienced.

when i scrolled down to the responses, i damn near fell off the chair.... so i just want you to know that i appreciated reading your post.

it's just different abroad. i think its all about the benjamins here and we have been brainwashed into being so fearful that we've lost a sense of community.

[belzjm]

thank you imboogie. i'm pretty disgusted by a few of the comments made also. but not entirely surprised. i love the notion that i must be spoiled because i go on vacation. people who make suggestions about other people in that manner are so ignorant that i have an easy time letting it brush aside.

i agree that it's different abroad, and at times i think about moving, but like i said i love new york and i'm IN love with park slope. so i figured hey...why not post here and get it off my chest. just because something is a certain way doesn't mean it can't change. if enough people want businesses to stay open later, it's a possibilty that it could be accommodated. i guess i just don't like the option of...it is this way so it must be forever. we live in one of the greatest cities in the world. i just think that it's become more and more such that we don't really take the time to enjoy and respect it in the manner we could

i was inspired by buenos aires, i've been inspired by barcelona and rome, etc. isn't that the whole reason for going on a vacation in the first place?

it is for me.

i suppose if i'm not talking about milfs or strollers, some people on here don't want to hear about it. they're right...let's stick to the more important topics in life.

[doldrums]

don't worry belzjm

I appreciated that you fell in love with Buenos Aires as that is where my spouse is from. Every time I visit I imagine living there one day. Although, as my wife always remarks" if I am not able to live in BA , I only want to live in Park Slope"

[Livetotravel]

well one thing for sure - you can at at least get a great steak in BA.

[new2slope]

belzjm, I agree with your original post... I'd like to be able to grab a slice after a night out, for sure. And, doublediamond, count me in at the roofdeck party!

[Baby Fishmouth]

Not sure if this helps, but I think Smiling Pizza is open until 1am or 2am on the weekends...I know all about the late-night pizza jones! When I lived in Queens, the pizza place near me shut down at 9pm. Oh, the humanity.

We'll never be like another country because, well, we're a different country. I remember years ago coming back from Greece and feeling really relaxed - people enjoy late dinners there and enjoy a glass of wine for dinner, and don't drink for the sake of drinking. I came back and met up with some friends at some post-frat bar, and after some drunk bozo made a comment about my tits (I wasn't breastfeeding, BTW), it made me really sad for being back in the US. In Greece, all I got were men saying I was beautiful, without the crass remarks. But, that's what makes the world go 'round - someone from another country right now might be bitching how his country could be more like the US!

[dw438]

Park Slope is a "bedroom" community, get it? Doesn't mean the streets roll up at 8pm, but there has to be accommodation for the majority that has to get up and go to work during standard US business hours.
There are places that stay open late ... both Pinos and Smiling open late, as do the donut shop and the Purity ... most of the bars stay open late ... and you can always get something at the Korean grocer just next to Smiling; he's open 24/7.
It's a big city, if you look hard enough you can always find something open at all hours.

[torisoaw]

Man, people get so worked up! Belzm, I thought your post was just fine -- and I don't think it was a jab at PS at all, just a thought/wishful thinking.
Anyway, Joe's Pizza (which is super delicious) on 5th and 11th/12th-ish has been open at 3am at couple of times when my husband and I were wandering home from Commonwealth. It's no croissant, but it works in a pinch.

[Livetotravel]

nobody said that belzm's post was a jab at PS - it's just not a legit comparison - Buenos Aires to Park Slope, European capitals to Park Slope, I mean it is the ultimate case of apples and oranges.

[belzjm]

i wasn't making a direct comparison. i was making an observation.

and the woman who's apartment i rented in buenos aires is staying in park slope for the summer for an internship...just a couple blocks from me. small world, huh. she in fact said the other night that park slope most reminds her of home more than any other nyc neighborhood. we both talked about a big difference being that everything here closes much earlier. i know...a different way of life. i'm not suggesting that the entire city change it's hours of business because i want them to. i was merely making some comments on what i've seen and what i thought possible if lots of other felt the same.

i have heard this from multiple people who live abroad and have come to visit park slope. you clearly don't speak with a lot of europeans, livetotravel if you haven't heard the comparisons between ps and some of the cities and towns over there.

i wasn't saying i wish park slope were buenos aires, simply commenting that it would be nice to have some places besides duane reade open late into the evening.

(obviously i'm exaggerating a bit)

some people get my comment, others don't.

[sprite]

It's funny; when I was in London, I was startled by how much earlier everything closed. I think my hotel was in a residential neighborhood, but I've seen as many people on the streets of PS at 1 am on a Tuesday as I did at 11 pm there. And the cleaning staff came by so early, it was clear the hotel usually caters to patrons who keep early hours.

OTOH, Californians also seem to keep earlier hours than New Yorkers, or at least the ones I've worked with. I assumed it was because so many businesspeople there have to deal with the East Coast. Maybe Londoners keep earlier hours because they're on the western edge of Europe.

Italiams seem to keep much later hours, but their restaurants shut down from 3 to 7 every day, so their entire schedule is different, probably due to the climate.

I don't think there are better or worse hours to keep; I think we're all adapting to our location. If it's a hot climate, it makes sense to have a siesta in the afternoon; if it's a cold climate, it makes sense to do as much business as possible before it gets dark and the temperature drops.

Just my two cents.
_________________
What is essential is invisible to the eye. —Antoine de Saint Exupéry

[raw]

[belzjm]

its not apples and oranges because most of said businesses abroad are also mom and pop. moreso than here in new york. i understand your point, but it's not really accurate. it's more of an actual family business there, but here the kids don't want to work in the same business as their parents. they'd rather work on wall street, make a lot of dough, etc. etc. i'm not saying that's good or bad. mom and pop shops are great and have the ability to change and aren't subject to such strict rules. if they saw a need or saw a potential to make money by staying open later, they'd have a much easier time of doing so than a gap. it's obvious that i'm in the minority and will call time warner and have them extend my cable plan to the super deluxe package.

sorry, i couldn't help myself.

it's different, i get it. but it's not as different as some people make it seem. i had no idea i'd annoy people for making an observation.

let's talk more about the strollers taking up 7th avenue.

much more fun.

[Newsome]

I'm glad PS is not an all night neighborhood. Being the family centered place it is, between work and kids we're happy to get some peace and quite late night so we can relax and get to sleep early. I would be horrified if PS turned into a hood for late night partying kids. I guess if you're a freelancer you might want to stroll into a coffee shop at 1am, but it's not for me.

[belzjm]

i suppose i was misunderstood. i did not mean to infer that i wish ps were an all night neighborhood. i enjoy the quiet also.

last night when walking around at 8 or 9 looking for a spot to have dinner with a friend, it would have been nice if we could have meandered into a shop or two...they were all closed. and when were were finished dinner, it would have been nice if oko was still open so i could have finally tried the frozen yogurt i hear is so tasty there.

go back to your babies and tv's...there's nothing to see here.

[Newsome]

[Santa]

maybe its becauase americans dont like working late and would rather go out and relax or drink.

I worked at a record store untill 10pm most nights and it was hell.

lets be rational here, if you have the luxary to walk into a store at 11pm just for giggles that poor man working is sitting there at 11pm with 1 or 2 people coming in every 30min.

[The Chipster]

What makes it impossible for ANY americans to live like Europeans:
Subsidized Child Care
Free Health Care
Siestas
Three times as much vacation time as ours (Yes, we Americans log more hours than the Japanese)
It has nothing to do with how late things are open--Las Vegas is open all the time, and errrr...no thanks! Most Amsterdam closes at 11pm--and yet the QUALITY of time enjoyed is....enjoyed.
We are in a rush to relax; and when we have a moment; uh-excuse me, let me just take this one call/check my email/fax this in....
_________________
Ask a burning question, get a burning answer.

[raw]

[raw]

[caseopele]

We used to be open until 9:30 M-Th and 10:00 on Friday and Saturday. About 2 years ago (I think) we switched to 9:00 M-Th and 9:30 on Friday and Saturday. Unfortunately, the few customers we got during that half hour weren't enough to justify keeping the store open.

I think the answers to why some businesses don't stay open very late are here:

[Restless Native]

Osaka goes full blast just about every night of the week, and they've got every excuse not to - long work hours, trains that stop running at 12am, etc.

So funny seeing businessmen in disheveled suits stumbling to work in the morning after spending all night at the cabaret clubs. I don't even want to get started on the stellar night cuisine out here.

Don't know if I can leave this lifestyle behind to return to Park Slope, where makeup application for women has gone the way of the abacus and 'Crocs' are the new heels.

[OpossumQueen]

[eggcream]

Your reading comprehension is lacking. Nobody is saying your a spoiled brat because you go on vacation. It's the fact that you are whining about PS and the hours here.

It was also pointed out in numerous posts about places in Park Slope that do stay open late, 5th and 7th ave, even Smiling Pizza to go for that tipsy slice yet your last post "go back to your babies and tv's...there's nothing to see here" is uncalled for. It's all or nothing for you isn't it.

[doctorj]

[daver]

[Santa]

also for the record I hate the term "cosmopolitan city"

[belzjm]

thanks for all the welcomes to the neighborhood.

i'm now beginning to see some truth in all the stories i hear about the inhabitants of park slope. eggcream...you don't seem to be able to have a conversation about anything without showing an incredible amount of disdain and anger. i was merely starting a conversation. i wasn't demanding anything. if you don't agree, how about trying to figure out a way to comment without sounding superior and condescending...

if it weren't for the brilliant architecture, i think i'd be outta here.

[Santa]

honestly if I used people who post in internet forums as a sample of an areas inhabitants than pretty much everywhere would be a hellhole.

but honestly your thread was alittle silly.

[belzjm]

yes santa, and these two examples of the incredibly thrilling and intellectual posts you've commented on over the past week makes mine seem so silly. i can see why you'd say that.

"im just confused now.
im gonna take a nap.
stop raising my rent"

"my gf just killed the largest cockroach ive ever seen the other day.
it as like an alien."

[Santa]

hahahaha

who said this forum was a lit class?

also this thread is silly because your entire thread is about park slope not being 24/7 when you live in the largest city in the US which has plenty of 24/7 options. Its a bummer park slope isnt 24/7 party central but if you walk alittle or get on the 24/7 subway system im sure you will find something.

also most Americans dont like working late because it sucks.