children and innoculations

Does anyone know of a pharmacy that has measles, mumps and rubella given out separately. I don't want the shots all together in a combo. I know it's hard to find, but there's got to be a pharmacy somewhere who has them individually, especially with all the contraversary about giving the combo and autism that we've been hearing about lately.

That autism link has been pretty well debunked, and the guy who started it is being looked at for ethics violations for making up the data. Just FYI.

New study that shows there is no link:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22542677/

Ethics violations (oops!):
http://www.babble.com/CS/blogs/strollerderby/archive/2009/02/08/researcher-fabricated-autism-link-in-vaccine.aspx

Exactly. There's no real controversy among anyone who's looked at the actual science. Like those who don't believe in global warming or evolution, there are some people who can never be convinced by any amount of evidence.

Subject: Re: children and innoculations

Vivian wrote: Does anyone know of a pharmacy that has measles, mumps and rubella given out separately. I don't want the shots all together in a combo. I know it's hard to find, but there's got to be a pharmacy somewhere who has them individually, especially with all the contraversary about giving the combo and autism that we've been hearing about lately.

Why not talk to your pediatrician and ask him/her if they can do it individually? I have never heard of a pharmacy giving out shots for these things (but then again my child is now 13). Personally, I am not sure I would trust a pharmacist to give my child their innoculations.

i have a 9 month old so we're in the whole shots phase right now. when we first started with our pediatrician they separated the shots. now they don't because Merck does not separate the shots any more.

Carnivore wrote: Exactly. There's no real controversy among anyone who's looked at the actual science. Like those who don't believe in global warming or evolution, there are some people who can never be convinced by any amount of evidence.

yet, I still know plenty of people who have children with autism who swear their child changed right after the vaccine. i don't know, I haven't read any of the scientific facts you both are speaking of.

Merck no longer manufactures the shots separately. According to Dr Sears, you should just get any shot that contains aluminum on separate visits. The vaccination schedule in his book is pretty easy to follow, as long as your pediatrician is on board.

If you're really seriously interested, PM me your e-mail address and I can send you some articles (I'd just post links, but most medical journals can only be accessed through a subscription unless you purchase the article, so unless you have a password for a medical library or are willing to pay, you wouldn't be able to read them). But if you don't really have any intention of reading them or if your mind is already made up, please don't bother.

Check with your doctor or check with the park slope parents group (maybe someone else can tell you where to find them)

Vaccines can be a bit of a shock to the system so I think parents and doc's separate them out a bit, esp. in babies these days. It's not necessarily b/c of a parent keeping their child from being vaccinated (which is very bad--see the measles outbreak in the UK. Bad.)

As for the autism link, from my understanding (lots of reading and school and work that exposes me to very specific discussions of this stuff) , the signs of autism happen to begin presenting around the same time as vaccines. And as someone else said, the individual who started the autism stuff has been debunked--the medical records used to support his paper in no way support his hypothesis and show that he falsified data. No shades of Grey.

A similar, hotly debated link: silicon breast implants and autoimmune disease. They were banned b/c of a concern that women who got them were also getting an autoimmune disease--there was no actual evidence, just mass hysteria after a few young, sick women went on the news saying the silicon made them sick. It also happens that the particular disease that's been around a while, starts showing signs and symptoms in young women (early 20s, give or take a few years). This happens to also be the same age group who gets implants the most. Once extensive studies were done in large numbers it was concluded that the silicon implants had no part in the disease and they are no longer banned.

I would definately talk to your pediatrician. While, as many of the above posters have pointed out, thimerisol or mercury in boosters as a cause of autism has been refuted, and the original study debunked, it can't hurt to hear all the options from your pediatrician. All evidence of a supposed link is circumstantial from case to case, although I have to admit all the anecdotes I've read from parents made me suspicious of mercury as a preservative.

We actually found that our pediatrician does not use vaccinations that contain thimerisol. He said that it was his opinion - through recent medical studies and research - that there was no connection but figured that if he could avoid it and keep the parents happy, why not.

besus wrote: We actually found that our pediatrician does not use vaccinations that contain thimerisol.

His job is made even easier because thimerosal is rarely used any more. Furthermore, MMR doesn't have it and NEVER had it, as stated in the table here:

http://www.fda.gov/CBER/vaccine/thimerosal.htm

If you want a simple explanation of why it makes no sense to spread out the shots, here is a pretty well written article:

http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/immu/too_many.html

sir_eccles wrote: [quote=besus]We actually found that our pediatrician does not use vaccinations that contain thimerisol.

His job is made even easier because thimerosal is rarely used any more. Furthermore, MMR doesn't have it and NEVER had it, as stated in the table here:

http://www.fda.gov/CBER/vaccine/thimerosal.htm

While it is rarely used any more in creating new vaccinations, it is, in fact, still around.

Thanks for all the info folks

sir_eccles wrote: If you want a simple explanation of why it makes no sense to spread out the shots, here is a pretty well written article:

http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/immu/too_many.html

While this article addresses the fact that one shouldn't be fearful of the amount of pathogens found in the vaccines, it does not address the additives, like aluminum, which is what most parents are fearful of. We know the toxic amount of aluminum for an adult, but no tests have ever been done to determine the amount safe for babies. That is why tests which contain the possibly harmful additives are spaced out.

OpossumQueen wrote:
As for the autism link, from my understanding (lots of reading and school and work that exposes me to very specific discussions of this stuff) , the signs of autism happen to begin presenting around the same time as vaccines. And as someone else said, the individual who started the autism stuff has been debunked--the medical records used to support his paper in no way support his hypothesis and show that he falsified data. No shades of Grey.

Exactly what I came in here to say. Lots of people don't seem to understand the difference between correlation and causation...

NYkittyNY wrote: [quote=sir_eccles]If you want a simple explanation of why it makes no sense to spread out the shots, here is a pretty well written article:

http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/immu/too_many.html

While this article addresses the fact that one shouldn't be fearful of the amount of pathogens found in the vaccines, it does not address the additives, like aluminum, which is what most parents are fearful of. We know the toxic amount of aluminum for an adult, but no tests have ever been done to determine the amount safe for babies. That is why tests which contain the possibly harmful additives are spaced out.

I would like to point out that MMR doesn't have aluminum in it either.

If you would like some random articles about aluminum why it is in vaccines and the relative risk:

http://www.immunizationinfo.org/vaccine_components_detail.cfv?id=61

http://www.webmd.com/parenting/news/20040129/aluminum-in-vaccines-poses-no-harm

http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/QAA400319/Aluminum-A-Vaccine-Danger.html

I would like to point out that MMR doesn't have aluminum in it either.

If you would like some random articles about aluminum why it is in vaccines and the relative risk:

My response was about vaccines in general, and not just the MMR, because the article you suggested reading was also about vaccines in general.

While it is clear why some vaccines include aluminum (put simply, it helps them to do what they are supposed to do in the body), it has never been tested or proven what amount of aluminum could be toxic for babies - we only know the amount that is toxic for adults. That is why the ones that contain aluminum are sometimes chosen to be spaced out instead of multiple amounts taken on the same day.

NYkittyNY wrote:

I would like to point out that MMR doesn't have aluminum in it either.

If you would like some random articles about aluminum why it is in vaccines and the relative risk:

My response was about vaccines in general, and not just the MMR, because the article you suggested reading was also about vaccines in general.

The OP was specifically asking about spacing out MMR. Three concerns (thimerosal, aluminum and too much of a shock) are generally raised as reasons for doing so. I have provided evidence that MMR has neither thimerosal nor aluminum and further evidence that the amount of exposure is insignificant compared to the number of microorganisms encountered in daily life.

The reason for separate shots is because the child gets sick after being given more than one vaccine at once. The pediatrician said to find a pharmacy that would carry the vaccine. But it's hard to find because the pharmacist can't order just one vile.

this should be on the family or kids board. or go to Park SLope Parents where they have tons of information about this. This is a specious argument based on bad science. but hey--decide for yourself.

Vivian wrote: The reason for separate shots is because the child gets sick after being given more than one vaccine at once. The pediatrician said to find a pharmacy that would carry the vaccine. But it's hard to find because the pharmacist can't order just one vile.

Let's forget, for a moment, that it's a VIAL and not a VILE. You surely can't be the only one in PS who is asking your ped for this kind of innoculation schedule. It sounds like your doc is not on board, and not willing to get on board.

While the thimerisol myth has been debunked, my ped gave my kids separate injections because there is profound autism in my immediately family, and she felt 'better safe than sorry". It took a while for her to get the shots, and we had to pay extra (insurance didn't cover it).

This was a while ago - 6 or 7 years, or more.

While the myth has been debunked, it would be to your benefit to find a doctor who is of like mind to your beliefs. Park Slope Parents is the place to go.

Lastly, I have never heard of being able to order your own prescriptions from a pharmacy. If you find one, let me know. I am in need of same pain killers, muscle relaxers. medical marijuana and liquid cocaine.

JOKING.

If we're going to be snarky about typos/spelling errors, it's thimerosal, or thiomersal, not thimerisol.

On a related note, is anyone around here old enough to have grown up with Mercurochrome? It made your cuts and scrapes look so festive!