which bars are child free?

exactly13 wrote: Someone just told me they think one of the owners of DW is a schoolteacher! Getting interesting now.

<yawn>. What's more controversial:

A schoolteacher that owns a bar that refuses to allow minors?

Or one that allows them.

Do tell.

The interesting thing is NOT kids in bars (for me) here, I find the argument to be inane.
I think the schoolteacher interest for me is in legality and discriminatory business practice for someone who should be trained or at least knowledgable.

One of the owners also has a toddler. So what?

Parents brought kids and they were inconsiderate to other patrons (yes, I heard the stories directly). They are no longer welcomed.

What exactly do you think the school teacher should be trained or at least knowledgeable ABOUT? Babysitting kids? Dealing with parents who let their own kids run wild in a bar (and I personally saw one running around in there. It was a large part of the reason I wouldn't go back........until now)?

exactly13 wrote: legality and discriminatory business practice for someone who should be trained or at least knowledgable.

Last I checked, school teachers are not required to have a law degree.

Or any training in business law, for that matter.

You might want to check with the UFT though.

I would think a teacher might open a bar as an escape from kids

Why can't they just have an only 21 and up rule? Why would food disallow such a rule?

And I agree with those of you said there are plenty of restaurants around here so just go somewhere that has highchairs if they want to take their kids.

Tell me you're joking? You think schoolteachers have NO background in proper ethical practice, discrimination issues? (Did not originally imply a law degree)

Ethics and the law are big subjects.

Are you saying that teachers should be trained in all aspects of ethics and business statutes (which vary by state and municipality, by the way...)?

exactly13 wrote: You cannot discriminate. I seriously doubt this is in any way legal.

(In the case of bars/no food I imagine the only loophole is that under 21 must be accompanied by over 21? Any lawyers out there?)

Not a lawyer, but, I know in Vegas kids are not allowed to be standing around casinos or even within a certain amount of feet from the casino floor, even with a parent with them. They are very strict about.

Actually there's a pretty compelling argument along ethical and business statutes guidelines that, if a teacher were to open a bar, it not allow minors.

No?

jeffrey wrote: Actually there's a pretty compelling argument along ethical and business statutes guidelines that, if a teacher were to open a bar, it not allow minors.

No?

=D> =D> =D>

jeffrey wrote: Ethics and the law are big subjects.

Are you saying that teachers should be trained in all aspects of ethics and business statutes (which vary by state and municipality, by the way...)?

NO! I am saying that schoolteachers are at the very least knowledgeable in proper ethics and non-discriminatory issues because it relates at all times to what they do. These areas are an essential part of their job.

Gotta get back to work or I'll end up on the dole. Lumberg will be lurking any minute now.

exactly13 wrote: You cannot discriminate. I seriously doubt this is in any way legal.

(In the case of bars/no food I imagine the only loophole is that under 21 must be accompanied by over 21? Any lawyers out there?)

Often when I go to bars in Manhattan and other cities, there is a Bouncer at the front door checking IDs to make sure that everyone who enters is legal age, at all times of day, regardless of whether they are with someone over 21 or not. Bars have done this for years and years, and I don't think it is illegal. What is DEFINITELY illegal is if someone under 21 drinks on the premises. Its really difficult and expensive to obtain a liquor license in NYS, so maybe they don't want to risk it? Can you blame them ?

It does seem a little ironic to be "all ages" during the time of day when ONLY alcohol is served, then become "21 and over" as soon as food is served.

This is why kids don't belong in bars.

As some people have already said, I really think everyone on both sides of this rather Heated Controversy would just basically "vote" by taking their business to whatever establishments cater to their side, everything would just kind of settle where it needs to be. Businesses will adjust themselves accordingly, and a few already have. No need to get indignant, just go where you feel welcome and comfortable. If you are sure you don't want to be around kids, take your business to one of the places with a policy in place. If you want to bring your kids somewhere, and there is a sign on the door stating they are not welcome, then you have plenty of other choices.
Too bad we don't have a Zagat-style guide to detail the kid policy of all bars in the neighborhood

Ill gladly lend my swearing self to the cause.
Call me up ill come over stand next to the parents and kids end let fly.
I know plenty of good words, starting with F, T , C , A and several other letters of the alphabet.
I wont charge a fee beyond the beer that I will comsume that night.

I disagree that the issue is whether banning children is legal or not. Do people seriously recommend the minimum of civility be "do whatever you want if it's legal"? What kind of society would that create?

The owner of a business should have the right to accept or reject any customer for any reason or no reason. He or she OWNS THE BUSINESS. I know NYC is a bastion of liberal nanny-state proponents, but really, if you wouldn't want the government telling you whom you have to invite to your next dinner party, you shouldn't want the government to tell a business owner whom he or she has to serve. Please, feel free to discriminate against me because I'm female, or white, or over 40, or have my toddler with me, or don't have my toddler with me (love to see a childfree adult try to spend some time at places catering to kids--how would the stroller mafia like antidiscriminatory policies if little Sophie or Dashiell were being ogled???)

I got to say, and this is something I am rarely able to say, but, I am pretty proud of my fellow PSP, most of them are coming out pro this and asking where this bar is so they can go there and enjoy childfree drinking themselves!

Long Time Sloper, I would totally agree, if it weren't for the past 2 weeks of incessant circumcision/vaccination shenanigans.

One of the issues I have with this topic is that the anti side infers strongly that a bar that would allow people in with their children is beset with them.
I would say not the case and in my experience this is the way it is. Sometimes but certainly not even statistically close (and I drink in both 'types' of establishments by this topics definition)
Someplace like 2 Boots would be only place I know of that is majority yes but apart from them?

new2hood wrote: Long Time Sloper, I would totally agree, if it weren't for the past 2 weeks of incessant circumcision/vaccination shenanigans.

Please, please, do not get me started about the circ issues on that freaking board!!! I have had more arguments and battles with it than I can handle, it makes me soooooo angry!!!! I just ignore the vax stuff, lol

new2hood wrote: Here's my thing: if you want to take your kid out and have a beer, there are plenty of places that welcome your business. If you want to go out and have a beer without kids, there are plenty of places that welcome your business. Why all the hoopla about whichever group you don't fit into?

This sort of reasonableness will get us nowhere.

Where is the bloodlust? Where is the monomaniacalism? Where is the personal invective?

Cut it out, before we're all out of a valuable pass time! You... you.... ninny!

exactly13 wrote: One of the issues I have with this topic is that the anti side infers strongly that a bar that would allow people in with their children is beset with them.
I would say not the case and in my experience this is the way it is. Sometimes but certainly not even statistically close (and I drink in both 'types' of establishments by this topics definition)
Someplace like 2 Boots would be only place I know of that is majority yes but apart from them?

huh? 2 boots is not a bar. 2 boots is a pizza joint.

d_luxx> Totally agreed. I do not want to be told to watch my language at a bar---not a restaurant--- because he brought his kids, at 9pm, that's ridiculous.

Oh, sorry, I was commenting on the post long time ago...

i am a parent.
just because i am parent/teacher/nanny/physician doesn't mean i want to be around your kids on my time off. 1 child or 12, it's a dark bar where some of us want to meet other adults, and some of us want to be left alone, get drunk and not trip over a stroller on our way out.
as depressing as it is that you bring up lawsuits and "discrimination" as a knee jerk response; i cannot wait to break my fkn ass on a stroller and sue the numnutz who rode in on it!

SouthSlopeSuit wrote: This sort of reasonableness will get us nowhere.

Where is the bloodlust? Where is the monomaniacalism? Where is the personal invective?

http://www.brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=55734

Chipster.. I am so with the last post you put up on this thread..
Love kids. I really do and the ones on the blood relative list are the highest on love quotient.

But, I just had 6 hours of kids in my house and I would go out to a bar tonight.. but.. it will take the rest of the evening to clean up the mess they left.

So... I agree that even if you are a parent or a grand parent, if you want to drink in a bar.. best if it is kid free!

signed

the best momma and gramma in the world

(but I have my limits)

I don't want to see kids in a bar.

this is what miss manners says:
http://lifestyle.msn.com/relationships/article.aspx?cp-documentid=22321812

what i think:
not allowed. if i wanted to go out where kids are welcome in my nabe: windsor cafe, terrace, clemens.

i'm not anti-child, i just don't want their attendance to interfere with my potty mouth when i'm going out for a drink. i wouldn't curse loudly at any of the aforementioned places. i actually wouldn't mind a mom with a small, non-mobile baby in a sling/bjorn, so long as she excused herself when the little one starts screaming.

i'm not sure when this became okay, but most of our parents were able to get along just fine without bringing us to pubs. being a parent means, i believe, making life changes. this should be one of them. do moms and dads really need to have this social life? you have a baby, things change. they just do.

I've never seen anyone under 21 in O'Connor's (5th bet Bergen and Dean). No kids in there, EVER, on top of it being one of the most classic bars in the neighborhood, with a very cool, unpretentious clientele.

If you have a chance to go there during the day during the week, tell Chris that Dan says hello. One of the great bartenders in the history of bartending, a true Brooklyn treasure.