Officials Euthanize Nearly 400 Geese From Prospect Park

Carnivore wrote: One human life is worth an infinite number of geese.

you're usually so rational, carnivore, but you're slipping here. this statement may help you feel better about eating foie gras but it isn't logically, philosophically or practically defensible.

Good point. I have to give Mougar more credit.

Danny is still proselytizing, so I guess we should have to go out and eat meat at some point in the future. ....otherwise, I personally would likely have been eating pasta or something.

Poor animals are going to die because of Danny.

Bear Mountain should happen next (date TBD by not me)
So, let's think about Danny's dinner happenng in late August.

Danny can come if he likes, or go eat vegetables with vegetarians. I would totally come if he organized a vegetarian outing ....veggies are yummy. I don't need meat with every meal. ...just when I'm told I am evil for eating it.

Smokin' Joe wrote: [quote=Carnivore]One human life is worth an infinite number of geese.

you're usually so rational, carnivore, but you're slipping here. this statement may help you feel better about eating foie gras but it isn't logically, philosophically or practically defensible.
No, I agree foie gras is a totally separate issue. I eat foie gras because it is delicious, and I don't believe that animals have a "right" to not be eaten. My comment was about the other problems caused by geese, particularly with respect to their ability to cause an airline crash.

Carnivore wrote:

You're right, we should all return to a pre-Industrial way of life to preserve the precious geese. Of course, that means most of us would have to leave the cities to go work on a farm. You'd better get off the computer and start building up some calluses.

There's nothing pre-industrial about train travel which, if it were expanded and modernized, would be a cleaner and more comfortable alternative to most of our domestic air travel.

Also, I suspect that if humans can put one of their kind on the Moon, they can also figure out how to design an airplane that isn't susceptible to goose attack.

Please work on that while we are busy killing geese. k thnx

But what of the space geese.

Danny Hellman wrote: Also, I suspect that if humans can put one of their kind on the Moon, they can also figure out how to design an airplane that isn't susceptible to goose attack.

I'm sure you'd appreciate some tips on drawing cartoons from engineers, but I suspect they'll do better without your help.

I'm late to this thread, but these animals were not "euthanized".

Euthanasia is ending a life to prevent further suffering. These geese were not suffering.

(What's bad for the goose is bad for the gander.)

Carnivore wrote:
I'm sure you'd appreciate some tips on drawing cartoons from engineers, but I suspect they'll do better without your help.

I'm not pretending to be an aircraft designer. Are you? Are you telling me that it's impossible to design an airplane that can't be brought down by a flock of geese? What's next? Can a big enough swarm of bees bring down an aircraft? Let's kill all the bees in a seven mile radius of the airport, and any butterfly that comes too close better watch his ass. It's fucking laughable.

Look, here's something else you might be able to eat, "Carnivore."

Danny Hellman wrote: I'm not pretending to be an aircraft designer. Are you? Are you telling me that it's impossible to design an airplane that can't be brought down by a flock of geese? What's next? Can a big enough swarm of bees bring down an aircraft? Let's kill all the bees in a seven mile radius of the airport, and any butterfly that comes too close better watch his ass. It's fucking laughable.

I'm not saying that it is impossible to do, I'm saying that you're hardly the first person to conceive of the idea, and that if it were a simple proposition, it would have already been achieved. Meanwhile, your hyperbole about bees and butterflies notwithstanding, the fact that geese can bring down a plane is demonstrably true. Until that problem is solved, something your musings are not contributing anything towards, it is better to kill the geese than to put people at risk or to end all air travel.

And that other thing looks like it would taste a bit gamey. I'd try it once.

the college that I attended from '88 - '92 had a contract with the Department of Defense to simulate bird encounters.

Depending on their mood, they would launch either Purdue chickens at running jet engines, or simulated "birds" concocted from jello and sticks. Sometimes they also shot "birds" at windshields.

My roomate was an engineering student. He loved to put random things in the bird cannon and launch them against the wall.

We'd break into the hanger/lab after hours. Good times.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=bird+strike+cannon+simulator&aq=0&aqi=m1&aql=&oq=bird+stike+cannon+simulator&gs_rfai=Ci0AnhFo_TNePEofAzQTWkKT_CwAAAKoEBU_QlBa8

Needless to say, he was also a big fan of David Letterman's stunts wherein he would drop stuff off buildings.

....the college still has that contract. I just PM'd the details to Carnivore.

Carnivore wrote:
your hyperbole about bees and butterflies notwithstanding, the fact that geese can bring down a plane is demonstrably true. Until that problem is solved, something your musings are not contributing anything towards, it is better to kill the geese than to put people at risk or to end all air travel.

If no one raises an objection to killing the geese, then there's no incentive at all to come up with a more humane system. I imagine that most of the folks who design airplanes, run airports and run the USDA are much like yourself, (i.e. people who don't give a shit about animals).

when they test out plans they throw frozen geese at the engines from what i remember.

check out my sig!!

Danny Hellman wrote: [quote=Carnivore]
your hyperbole about bees and butterflies notwithstanding, the fact that geese can bring down a plane is demonstrably true. Until that problem is solved, something your musings are not contributing anything towards, it is better to kill the geese than to put people at risk or to end all air travel.

If no one raises an objection to killing the geese, then there's no incentive at all to come up with a more humane system. I imagine that most of the folks who design airplanes, run airports and run the USDA are much like yourself, (i.e. people who don't give a shit about animals).

That's not very nice.
I'm telling my old roomate Kevin you said that about him.

I can contact him via Facebook. We haven't gotten together in a while.

I think like most of us, he likes animals but knows they do not have same rights as people. As most of us agree, some of them are also quite yummy.

whynot_31 wrote: I think like most of us, he likes animals but know they do not have same rights as people. As most of us agree, some of them are also quite yummy.

This.

whynot_31 wrote:
I think like most of us, he likes animals but knows they do not have same rights as people.

People are animals.

Danny Hellman wrote: [quote=whynot_31]
I think like most of us, he likes animals but knows they do not have same rights as people.

People are animals.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Do we really have to go through this again?

according to all cannibals that was ever ask what people taste like what animal. they all answer pork.

The graph above depicts what is known as a "subset".

....clearly we are going to have to go out to dinner again.

whynot_31 wrote: The graph above depicts what is known as a "subset".

....clearly we are going to have to go out to dinner again.

I want the Pig!!! I have my elastic pants ready to go!

You and me, Stacey! Would just need 10 more friends!

booklaw wrote: You and me, Stacey! Would just need 10 more friends!

completely doable. Mougar, Carnie, mama........ Etc

when is this happening

Back to geese, ducks, and Prospect Park...
http://www.alternet.org/news/147571/outrage_builds_over_extermination_of_hundreds_of_geese_from_major_city_park_in_new_york/

jeffrey wrote: when is this happening

No date has been set yet.

....I'm thinking August.

It will take people at least two weeks to decide where to go.

Let's discuss where we want to go, and when on this thread, then create a global thread entitled "Danny's Hellman's Dinner" once we get our acts together.

:twisted:

I'll be away next week, so I trust I am leaving this issue in capable hands.

The best part of this upstanding thread is that I've learned a lot about both sides' positions. The well-reasoned arguments presented in a manner of mutual respect have really opened my eyes to the possibility that my feelings about this issue may be flawed. From now on, I'll try to consider the other side's position before jumping to my usual conclusions. Thanks for expanding my horizons, Brooklynian! You've changed my life!

Wildlife Management at Prospect Park

Prospect Park Alliance
4:06 PM

Dear Friends of Prospect Park:
The recent culling of Canada Geese in Prospect Park is disturbing to many people, including staff at the Park. That people care so passionately about the Park and its natural environment and speak out in its defense is truly wonderful and very welcomed.

The Canada Geese were removed from the Park late last week and euthanized as part of a joint U.S. Department of Agriculture, Port Authority and City of New York program to reduce the geese population near the flight paths of area airports. Prospect Park is one of a number of parks and locations chosen by the City of New York to be included in this program.

Prospect Park is a public, New York City park and is administered in accordance with City, State and Federal regulations and policies. However many Park users have contacted us in recent days about what can be done in the future to avoid this situation.

The staff at Prospect Park, both the Alliance and the Parks Department, recognize that we are the stewards of this amazing greenspace and public resource. Over the years we have undertaken extensive restoration of the Park's natural areas and watercourse to provide wildlife with hundreds of acres of healthy habitat. We have a wonderful natural resources crew who work year round to keep the habitat healthy and a staff of naturalists at our Audubon Center who educate thousands of young people annually about the importance of wildlife.

To provide the best ongoing ecological care of our habitat, the Park will be forming a wildlife management taskforce comprised of experts in the field. This will strengthen the Alliance and Parks Department's commitment to safeguarding both nature and people.

Prospect Park is one of many City, State and Federally managed parks in the metropolitan area and holistic stewardship of the regional ecology is important. Prospect Park is our park - thankfully many of you consider it your park - and with your help, we can continue to work together to ensure Prospect Park remains healthy and beautiful.

Sincerely yours,
Tupper Thomas
Prospect Park Administrator/Prospect Park Alliance President

www.prospectpark.org

Is it just me or did they completely skirt around any real reply?

it's not you. As far as I can tell the message says absolutely nothing.