The low life losers are out tonight

IMO, I 'd say people of color are as racist, if not more, than people not of color. Prejudice is a two-way street. White people rarely mug, rape, murder black people.

In all seriousness, Meredith, where are you from?

OK, so I have so much to respond to and I don't know where to start. First, the loose ends: CTK, Meredith, P'spectPlGirl, and everybody else who have had such wonderful things to say about me, that's cool. It's an open blog and a free country, kind of. I respect all of your opinions. However, as far as this thing about racism goes, I did not introduce that into this thread. Silverager suggested that I am a racist. I responded to that. If anybody on this site can show me how I am a racist, please do.

As far as I, and most Black people I know are concerned, the most common experience with racism in this country has been one of prejudice associated with power. If that doesn't jibe with the experiences of Cool The Kid and ProspectPlGirl, that's fine. Not every Black person has had the same experience with racism, and there are those who have never encountered it at all. But as a person who continues to deal with experiencing racism in its different forms I am not interested in lessons about what racism is from any person on this thread, Black or white. However, I have enjoyed reading how many of the white posters have relished teaching those lessons while trying to put me in my place. That is what makes DH unique, and necessary I suppose.

People, "racism," "prejudice," "stereotyping," and "hatred" are not interchangeable. They don't mean the same thing. Carnivore, do you think that those Black kids behaved like that towards those Asians because the Black kids thought they were racially superior (definition from BrookFetish) to the Asians? I don't think so. ProspectPlaceGirl, to repeat what I wrote before, I do consider myself to be part of this neighborhood, I just don't consider it "my" neighborhood. I don't know how many times I have to try to explain that. Also it's interesting that you consider me one of "those," because judging from what you have written, you fit perfectly into a similar category of mine. Now that is really funny. "High horse?" Please explain.

Cool The Kid, again, I never said it was OK for the violence to have been committed, and what leg am I trying to stand on? This is not a competition. I have my opinion, and some share it and some do not. That's fine. If I've left anybody or any issue out, please post your concerns, or PM me, and I will respond appropriately. OK now- everybody take a deep breath, and smile.

liftandcut wrote:

IMO, I 'd say people of color are as racist, if not more, than people not of color. Prejudice is a two-way street. White people rarely mug, rape, murder black people.

In all seriousness, Meredith, where are you from?

OK, so I have so much to respond to and I don't know where to start. First, the loose ends: CTK, Meredith, P'spectPlGirl, and everybody else who have had such wonderful things to say about me, that's cool. It's an open blog and a free country, kind of. I respect all of your opinions. However, as far as this thing about racism goes, I did not introduce that into this thread. Silverager suggested that I am a racist. I responded to that. If anybody on this site can show me how I am a racist, please do.

As far as I, and most Black people I know are concerned, the most common experience with racism in this country has been one of prejudice associated with power. If that doesn't jibe with the experiences of Cool The Kid and ProspectPlGirl, that's fine. Not every Black person has had the same experience with racism, and there are those who have never encountered it at all. But as a person who continues to deal with experiencing racism in its different forms I am not interested in lessons about what racism is from any person on this thread, Black or white. However, I have enjoyed reading how many of the white posters have relished teaching those lessons while trying to put me in my place. That is what makes DH unique, and necessary I suppose.

People, "racism," "prejudice," "stereotyping," and "hatred" are not interchangeable. They don't mean the same thing. Carnivore, do you think that those Black kids behaved like that towards those Asians because the Black kids thought they were racially superior (definition from BrookFetish) to the Asians? I don't think so. ProspectPlaceGirl, to repeat what I wrote before, I do consider myself to be part of this neighborhood, I just don't consider it "my" neighborhood. I don't know how many times I have to try to explain that. Also it's interesting that you consider me one of "those," because judging from what you have written, you fit perfectly into a similar category of mine. Now that is really funny. "High horse?" Please explain.

Cool The Kid, again, I never said it was OK for the violence to have been committed, and what leg am I trying to stand on? This is not a competition. I have my opinion, and some share it and some do not. That's fine. If I've left anybody or any issue out, please post your concerns, or PM me, and I will respond appropriately. OK now- everybody take a deep breath, and smile.

I think I need 2 aspirins and a decoder ring to decipher that post.

liftandcut wrote:

IMO, I 'd say people of color are as racist, if not more, than people not of color. Prejudice is a two-way street. White people rarely mug, rape, murder black people.

In all seriousness, Meredith, where are you from?

What planet is Meredith from or is she pulling our black, brown, orange and pink legs?

Even if it were true (I'm not checking statistics, so I really don't know) that "white people rarely rape black people" today, just look at all the "black" people walking around today that look a lot different from any African ancestors. European-American slave owners have murdered and raped the life out of African-American slaves for hundreds of years; look at this country's tradition of slavery. Even if it were true that today "pure" Europeans did not hurt any people, history proves that any person from a specific group can be evil.

liftandcut wrote: OK smarty-pants, so you understand: explaining to me how I am a racist is different than defining the term racism to me. For example: you probably don't need me to tell you what a Christian Fundamentalist is, but you might want me to tell you why I think you are a Christian Fundamentalist.

Well played, sir!

liftandcut wrote: I've lived here for six years, and I don't think it's "my" neighborhood.

Then you are part of the problem and should get out of the way.

filmlover44 wrote: [quote=BrookFetish][quote=BrookFetish][quote=liftandcut]First of all, as a person of color, it is virtually impossible for me to be a racist. Look the term up.

You can't be serious.

Noun1.racist - a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others

A PERSON...regardless of color

Sigh. I don't think that liftandcut has said that she thinks that one race is superior to others. Just because someone is a jerk, there is no need to call them nazi's or racists.

And, herdefinition of "racism" is a commonly held one in anti-racism ("racism = prejudice + power)- not one that she made up. It does not mean that a minority can not be a bigot, ignorant or a jerk. In fact, an important part of anti-racism is dealing with the kind of self-hatred that allows minorities to think that the kind of behavior described in this thread is "ok" or justify it.

Of all the things I have read on DH, that has to be the most disturbing thing written by a DHer. I see, so you're the one who is going to save "minorities" from themselves? Wow, and all this time I thought it was Jesus, God, and Minister Farrakhan. You mean, you've been living in this neighborhood all this time with all of the answers for all of us minorities, and you've been sitting on them? Boy, you must be one special hombre. So, us minorities tend to think violence against whites by other minorities is OK? Let me get this straight- that is due to self-hate? "Martha, go call Sharpton and tell him he's out of a job!" Holy moley. Stunning. It's bad to call me a Nazi or a racist, but an ignorant jerk bigot is just fine. Gotcha. Another thing- I don't think I own this neighborhood and that's part of the problem and I should get out of the way? Such sound advice. Brilliant, really.

For the last time: I never justified any violence. My problem is with an attitude that I have seen in people who are moving to this neighborhood that it is now theirs, and that others who are from this neighborhood are less significant. It's so simple.

liftandcut wrote:
Of all the things I have read on DH, that has to be the most disturbing thing written by a DHer. I see, so you're the one who is going to save "minorities" from themselves?

Ha ha! Your ASSumptions are really funny. It's not the first time that someone has made faulty assumptions about me on this board but yours has got to be the funniest I've read. I'm not one of your little liberal white friends that you get to bully around with your faux outrage.

It's up to US to save ourselves. Until you can figure that out, you need to get out of the way.

And, FYI I never said that you justified violence, but you do make thinly veiled excuses for behavior that doesn't serve anyone in the nabe well newcomer or not (and for the record, as someone who has lived long enough to see many neighborhoods "gentrified", I spend considerable time in PH and CH but I don't live there ).

Glad to hear that the original poster made it home safely and nothing happened to him and his wife. One thing that I have been reading, and I may just be jaded or something, but this does not seem to me to be violence. Intimidation, Yes, Violence, No. Not being there in the situation, these kids may have been having what they consider "fun" at the posters expense. Not saying right or wrong, which personally I believe it is wrong, but once they saw that he was intimidated, they went further by shadowing them down the block. One last thing is that this happens in all neighborhoods from all people. I live in Crown Heights and it has happened to me, where a bunch of young Jewish guys, attempted to intimidate me one night. Once you don't show that you are being intimidated, it usually stops. And with the other subject, there are people that are moving into the neighborhoods and not treating the people who have been there through the bad times any respect. Some people, not all, move in and try to change the character of the neighborhood over time, and complain about the people who have grown up there and have familial roots there. Sadly, a lot of these hoods are changing from a neighborhood where people are looking out for each other to just a place where you live. I guess that is progress, but it is sad none the less.

"I live in Crown Heights and it has happened to me, where a bunch of young Jewish guys, attempted to intimidate me one night."

A group of young Jewish kids is hardly intimidating. I'd imagine they don't throw punches and chase couples down the block either.

..."and I may just be jaded or something, but this does not seem to me to be violence. Intimidation, Yes, Violence, No."

Apparently you haven't been reading this Board lately, but getting randomly punched, thrown punches at, getting bottles thrown at you, getting chased down the street, trying to kick dogs is extremely violent, downplaying these events is a major part of the problem. Until this behavior is taken seriously, and not just looked at as"kid stuff", these type of incidents will continue to happen.

Karl the Druid wrote: tricksters

they tried to convert me as well

so i (+1) maced them

Is it just me, or do you add nothing to this Board?

King without a crown wrote: Is it just me, or do you add nothing to this Board?

levity

well on this board

i once gave solid horticulture advice

about winter care for tender perennials

and succulents in our temperate zone 6.5 - 7.0

i even made a diagram of a cat attacking a house plant

but no one even noticed

hurt, so hurt

Karl the Druid wrote: well on this board

i once gave solid horticulture advice

about winter care for tender perennials

and succulents in our temperate zone 6.5 - 7.0

i even made a diagram of a cat attacking a house plant

but no one even noticed

hurt, so hurt

Where be this diagram? I demand a repost!

A group of young Jewish kids is hardly intimidating. I'd imagine they don't throw punches and chase couples down the block either.

I don't see the difference in whether it is a bunch of young men that are Jewish or a bunch of young men that are black or hispanic. The same group mentality holds irregardless of race or culture. Maybe for you a group of Jewish Kids is not intimidating and maybe for me a group of black kids is not intimidating. That being said, intimidation can come from anywhere and has no basis in who the intimidater is but only the mentality of the person who feels they are being intimidated. The only difference that I see is that the kids in my story were laughing and making derogatory comments, I could have ran home too but didn't. The intimidation factor was still there so no, sorry don't see the difference.

..."and I may just be jaded or something, but this does not seem to me to be violence. Intimidation, Yes, Violence, No."

Apparently you haven't been reading this Board lately, but getting randomly punched, thrown punches at, getting bottles thrown at you, getting chased down the street, trying to kick dogs is extremely violent, downplaying these events is a major part of the problem. Until this behavior is taken seriously, and not just looked at as"kid stuff", these type of incidents will continue to happen.

I was responding the the original poster who stated that out of the side of his eye, he saw a "black" kid take a swing at him. He was not hit, he was not verbally threatened. He stated that the kids followed him and him and his wife ran the rest of the way home. I did not read that the kids were running after them or that the kids ever said anything to the couple. That is why I said it appears to be intimidation not violence. My comment was only based on the original poster not all the posts or anyone else's experience. I do not condone violence and if violence occurs towards a person they should persue whatever remedies that they can through the police. I also don't condone a case being made that one thing is violence and needs to be reported to the police and the same thing from another group of people not being violence. Same rules apply for all people, and if I can ignore one set of people then I can ignore another set of people as long as no violence or crime has occurred. Me feeling uncomfortable for a minute is not a reason for me to pull some kid into a line up.

Someone throwing a punch at someone is certainly Violent, the fact that they missed, or didnt try to hit him, doesn't lessen the act. If I fire a shot at someone and miss, it's still a violent act regardless of the intention. Being intimidated by a group of Jewish kids might be intimidating, but I'd imagine their behavior didn't include throwing punches and chasing nice couples home.