screwed by soda
with a large group at soda bar last night... the check came to more than expected and it wasn't until we spent a long time trying to figure who owed more that we were told that the tip had been included. perhaps we should have assumed it, but nevertheless criminal to not tell us that on the check or when it was delivered. additionally, we found a modest overcharge. bastards. watch out!
Comments
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FYI I have found that once you reach six in your party, _many_ places will include the tip. For future reference. I've rarely had them say, "Hey, the tip is in there," but I have always had them answer in the clearly affirmative to, "Hey, did you put the tip in there?"
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daver wrote: FYI I have found that once you reach six in your party, _many_ places will include the tip. For future reference. I've rarely had them say, "Hey, the tip is in there," but I have always had them answer in the clearly affirmative to, "Hey, did you put the tip in there?"
yes, but it is not up to the customer to realize or ask, they are unquestionably obliged to tell. of course they don't because they hope to be double tipped, which i am sure often occurs - we almost did it last night. -
Oh yeah, they are totally hoping to be double tipped. I don't go to Soda, so I know nothing about their practice. But this has happened to me frequently other places in the two years I've been in NYC now. I've chalked it up to my list of quaint NYC customs. I always checked the bill anyhow before I moved out here anyway, NYC certainly doesn't have the market cornered on screwing people over, but now I _really_ do.
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Oh yeah, they are totally hoping to be double tipped. I don't go to Soda, so I know nothing about their practice. But this has happened to me frequently other places in the two years I've been in NYC now. I've chalked it up to my list of quaint NYC customs.
Let us not assume that this "custom" happens everywhere. Last month I was w/ a party of eight for brunch at Teddy's in Williamsburg and when the check came we all just threw in $40 or so. When you have little children (read: distracted) and it's a relatively inexpensive meal—and no one's really drinking—one tends not to scrutinize the bill. Well our server came back and was like "this is WAY too much money" and indeed, the tip was included. And for her honesty, she got all of the money. -
...I think it's kind of a given in the majority of restaurants both in and out of New York City that when you have a large group, the tip is included in the check. Check the menu next time -- they may have a note at the bottom that says something to that effect.
It's not a hard-and-fast rule, but it's one that's ubiquitous enough that many places assume that the customer assumes that that's the case anyway; it'd be safer for them to print something somewhere about it, but if they didn't, I'd actually consider it only a minor sin on their part (something like McDonald's not printing on the cups that their coffee was hot right from the get-go, say). -
I'm making light. FYI.
Many places all over the country have small notices that they _may_ include it. NYC is the FIRST place where I had it regularly included in my bill for a family of six, ma, pa, and four kids. I have had it included at other places sometimes for large (10+) groups of adults.
My recommendation based on dining experience is to not pay attention to the note in the menu or whatever, which will generally say that they _may_ include it. My recommendation is 1) check your bill. 2) If there are at least six people in your party then DOUBLE check your bill for a tip. 3) If you can't figure it out, then ask.
My experience has been that it is FAR MORE likely to be included here than on the west coast or parts between, if that makes someone angry, then pffft. Don't care. Feel free to ignore my suggestions, 'cause Jimmy crack corn and I don't care. -
queencallipygos wrote: I'd actually consider it only a minor sin on their part (something like McDonald's not printing on the cups that their coffee was hot right from the get-go, say).
you're wack, must be a soda waitress. -
Tavern on Dean includes tips on ALL checks. I'm guessing the waitstaff there gets double-tipped on a frequent basis.
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daver wrote: 1) check your bill. 2) If there are at least six people in your party then DOUBLE check your bill for a tip.
there was absolutely no way to notice a tip on the check. there may have been a number among the scribbles, but it was covered over by a total amount, written huge in a red marker - probably not, but perhaps an extra effort at deception. -
Subject: Double Tipping
When the tip is included in the bill, you are seldom reminded.
They want you to tip again. It is called "thanks and thanks again."
Put just a bit of airplane glue in the lock of the door when they are closed. it helps them see the value of being honest.
Sad but true.
H -
BrookFetish wrote: Tavern on Dean includes tips on ALL checks. I'm guessing the waitstaff there gets double-tipped on a frequent basis.
But they print it right on the menu. Surely no deception there. And they charge 17%, which is less than I'd normally give anyway unless the service was subpar. I wonder what percent Soda charged. -
Carnivore wrote: [quote=BrookFetish]Tavern on Dean includes tips on ALL checks. I'm guessing the waitstaff there gets double-tipped on a frequent basis.
But they print it right on the menu. Surely no deception there. And they charge 17%, which is less than I'd normally give anyway unless the service was subpar. I wonder what percent Soda charged.
yet another reason why i wont go there
the restaurant/waiter/waitress should earn the tip not expect it
now when it is a large party and you have to take way your time from other tables then I understand it being included but not when it is a table of two -
putz wrote: [quote=queencallipygos]I'd actually consider it only a minor sin on their part (something like McDonald's not printing on the cups that their coffee was hot right from the get-go, say).
you're wack, must be a soda waitress.
....No, I'm a literary manager for a small theater company. I just pay attention to things like that.
Because if you think about it, who's more "wack" -- the person who pays attention to the price tag when they spend money, or the person who doesn't? -
Carnivore wrote: [quote=BrookFetish]Tavern on Dean includes tips on ALL checks. I'm guessing the waitstaff there gets double-tipped on a frequent basis.
But they print it right on the menu. Surely no deception there. And they charge 17%, which is less than I'd normally give anyway unless the service was subpar. I wonder what percent Soda charged.
maybe no deception per se, but a menu isn't a contract -- you shouldn't really have to read the fine print to see the price of your meal.
ToD's policy rubs me the wrong way -- and generally ends up in the waiter getting a smaller tip from me, since I typically give 20%. (Of course, on the few occasions I've eaten at ToD, the service has been friendly but less than quick or attentive. So maybe they end up getting more this way.) -
queencallipygos wrote: [quote=putz][quote=queencallipygos]I'd actually consider it only a minor sin on their part (something like McDonald's not printing on the cups that their coffee was hot right from the get-go, say).
you're wack, must be a soda waitress.
....No, I'm a literary manager for a small theater company. I just pay attention to things like that.
Because if you think about it, who's more "wack" -- the person who pays attention to the price tag when they spend money, or the person who doesn't?
you're not paying attention as you seem to have forgotten your own point, which was that its not a big deal even if they don't print anything on the menu or make it clear on the check, in which it is not a case of not paying attention to the price tag. -
Subject: soda
hey go down the block to JELANI LOUNGE you tip the bartender what you want and the place is nicy and cozy....check it out and happy hour on friday is from 8pm - 11pm -
putz wrote: [quote=queencallipygos][quote=putz][quote=queencallipygos]I'd actually consider it only a minor sin on their part (something like McDonald's not printing on the cups that their coffee was hot right from the get-go, say).
you're wack, must be a soda waitress.
....No, I'm a literary manager for a small theater company. I just pay attention to things like that.
Because if you think about it, who's more "wack" -- the person who pays attention to the price tag when they spend money, or the person who doesn't?
you're not paying attention as you seem to have forgotten your own point, which was that its not a big deal even if they don't print anything on the menu or make it clear on the check, in which it is not a case of not paying attention to the price tag.
....No, that's a case of my not being clear about my point.
Which is:
It is a common enough practice for the people at Soda to expect that customers would automatically assume, "hey, we've got a lot of people, I'm sure they'll tack on a service charge to the bill, because other places do that." Just like it is common enough knowledge for McDonald's to expect that customers would assume, "hey, this coffee must be hot."
So, ultimately, the place Soda failed is in expecting its customers to all have a certain degree of familiarity with other restaurant's practices, just like...I guess, like McDonald's had an expectation that its customers would be aware coffee was hot. However, spelling that out is always a safer policy for a business. I just don't think it's a matter of Soda gleefully trying to trick people, just like I don't think McDonald's was cackling and saying, "hey, let's see if we can scald people! Whee!" I think it's more a matter of both parties realizing, "....Oh, some people don't know that? Huh. Well, okay then."
That's what I meant.
My comment about reading the menu was in response to you saying that this was "wack" -- I know from seeing the phrase "gratiuties will be added to large parties" on MANY other restaurant menus that -- well, that many other restaurants do this. So it's NOT "wack". It's just something you hadn't heard of before, is all. -
Subject: Tips
Its really amazing that people who go to restaurants still don't know that every single Restaurant in NYC includes tip on their check for a party of 6 or more. Must be living somewhere in the jungle, i mean there is a reason why Tavern on the Dean includes tips on their checks, i won't go into details but for people who work in restaurants know what i am talking about. Try making a reservation in any restaurant for a party of 6 or more and it will always include tips. I just wish restaurants nowadays would include automatic tips for foreigners they never tip regardless if they are 1 or 10.... Don't get mad at the waiter, he is doing the right thing, its standard policy in every restaurant, be amazed at yourself for living in NYC AND NOT KNOWING IT! -
i seem to recall from the last time this discussion came up that in NYS, it's ILLEGAL to add tip for groups under 5 or 6. Or something like that.
anyone know? -
sweet tea wrote: i seem to recall from the last time this discussion came up that in NYS, it's ILLEGAL to add tip for groups under 5 or 6. Or something like that.
Really? :?
anyone know?
I've never heard of that. -
Carnivore wrote: [quote=sweet tea]i seem to recall from the last time this discussion came up that in NYS, it's ILLEGAL to add tip for groups under 5 or 6. Or something like that.
Really? :?
anyone know?
I've never heard of that.
According to the NYC Dept of Consumer Affairs it's OK for an establishment to charge a 15% gratuity in the check if it's conspicuously printed on the menu. Doesn't seem like this is followed, so diner/drinker beware. The word on the street is eat smart, I guess. -
BrookFetish wrote: Tavern on Dean includes tips on ALL checks. I'm guessing the waitstaff there gets double-tipped on a frequent basis.
I have to admit, I am offended by this. When it is not a large table, its not necessary.
The owner does this also to screw over the Waitstaff. They are then able to keep track and monitor the tips for tax purposes, which in turn, cuts into the tips. -
raisedeyebrow wrote: The owner does this also to screw over the Waitstaff. They are then able to keep track and monitor the tips for tax purposes, which in turn cuts into the tips.
heaven forbid someone follow the law and pay taxes -
raisedeyebrow wrote: [quote=BrookFetish]Tavern on Dean includes tips on ALL checks. I'm guessing the waitstaff there gets double-tipped on a frequent basis.
I have to admit, I am offended by this. When it is not a large table, its not necessary.
The owner does this also to screw over the Waitstaff. They are then able to keep track and monitor the tips for tax purposes, which in turn, cuts into the tips.
the one area of ToD this doesn't happen is the bar, fwiw. -
putz wrote: [quote=raisedeyebrow]The owner does this also to screw over the Waitstaff. They are then able to keep track and monitor the tips for tax purposes, which in turn cuts into the tips.
heaven forbid someone follow the law and pay taxes
well, when you get paid $3/hr, I dont think they should tax your tips. It's the gov that requires this. Most restaurants allow the servers to enter their tips and I haven't seen a restaurant get cited for it yet. -
I was a cocktail waitress at a very popular spot in Greenwich Village where when we entered our tips into the system, everyone just low-balled it. Management didn't care if it was the right number, just that it was A number.
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Their menu says they charge 18% for large parties...
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putz wrote: [quote=raisedeyebrow]The owner does this also to screw over the Waitstaff. They are then able to keep track and monitor the tips for tax purposes, which in turn cuts into the tips.
heaven forbid someone follow the law and pay taxes
My sister in law works in audit for the IRS.
Please contact me in a PM with your name and ss#. I can get you a volunteer audit as is done with people in high profile jobs.
If you do well, I will apologies here and kiss your butt on main street at high noon.
You game?
H -
Whatchuwant wrote: I was a cocktail waitress at a very popular spot in Greenwich Village where when we entered our tips into the system, everyone just low-balled it. Management didn't care if it was the right number, just that it was A number.
Which is why I pay tips in cash if I can.
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