Who needs a bookstore?
Comments
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Jack Krohn wrote: I agree that opening a small bookstore in this day and age seems risky. National chains are becoming more common in Brooklyn and online sites like Amazon (for new books) and half.com or abebooks.com (for used) lure yet other customers away. Most of the successful independents, such as those few remaining in Park Slope and Carroll Gardens, continue to thrive because they've been around for a long time. They have a loyal customer base and, most likely, long-term leases.
The key to this plan is the cafe. I agree that a bookstore on its own would be a risky proposition but a cafe can more than make up for any lost revenue on books. Add alcohol (beer, wine) to the mix and make it a night spot with events and the combined business could be very successful.
...
If you think I'm being negative, look at the archives and compare the number of posts about books and culture to those about bars, liquor stores, and getting drunk. I rest my case!
Washington Ave up by EP would be a great spot. There's foot traffic to/from the subway plus you can leverage the museum, library, and BBG for additional foot traffic. I think the people frequenting those institutions are a target market for this type of shop and people are always looking for a place nearby to meet before or after they go. -
Subject: Re: Who needs a bookstore?
booknerdnyc wrote: I'm going to open a literary bookstore in Brooklyn. Somewhere. Someday soon. It's gonna have all the newest and best hand-picked stuff, some kids books, comic books/graphic literature, and if I can I get enough space for a cafe, some killer events too. I've been exploring neighborhoods for months, looking for the right combination of cheap rent and educated folks with disposable income to make a place like this work. I don't know why I didn't discover this forum before!
Definitely in PH. It would be nice to have one near home.
So what do you think, PHers? Where do you think there's the greatest demand for a great literary bookstore? I noticed some folks suggesting south 5th Ave in a "What's Missing?" thread, and I'm looking into that too, but the rents seem to be prohibitive. Fourth Avenue might work. Or Vanderbilt. Or Washington. Or somewhere up closer to Fort Greene. Now I'm going to shut up and see what you think. Feel free to ask questions. -
i would love to see your bookstore/cafe here in the heights--washington, underhill or vanderbilt.
i agree with previous posters about the risk of a stand-alone bookstore here (or anywhere now, given the internet), as well as those who said that including a cafe for a second revenue stream and to get people in there would help. readings likewise. cool jazz and beat poetry anyone? -
After 25 years in the book business, I can't offer much encouragement. There's too much competition from amazon and the chains. The retail enviroment in NYC is brutal. Hiring good staff is almost impossible. I'm not surprised that people on this board are excited. Everyone likes bookstores. They especially like to hang out, read the magazines, spill coffee on the books, comparision shop etc. But like they say in retail, "We can't put your smiling face in the cash register." It would be very tough in PH to build the steady customer traffic that translates into a sales volume sufficient to pay yourself, your staff and your rent. There are too few residents and the daytime working population isn't particularly big either. There are a few successful bookstore models in Brooklyn but they tend to rely heavily on selling used books and/or have special niches well suited to their local demographics -- Spoonbill & Sugartown on Bedford in Williamsburg springs to mind. 4th Ave is an interesting idea -- especially if the space included parking. If you want to discuss this further off-line, let me know.
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Roz wrote: After 25 years in the book business, I can't offer much encouragement. There's too much competition from amazon and the chains. The retail enviroment in NYC is brutal. Hiring good staff is almost impossible. I'm not surprised that people on this board are excited. Everyone likes bookstores. They especially like to hang out, read the magazines, spill coffee on the books, comparision shop etc. But like they say in retail, "We can't put your smiling face in the cash register." It would be very tough in PH to build the steady customer traffic that translates into a sales volume sufficient to pay yourself, your staff and your rent. There are too few residents and the daytime working population isn't particularly big either. There are a few successful bookstore models in Brooklyn but they tend to rely heavily on selling used books and/or have special niches well suited to their local demographics -- Spoonbill & Sugartown on Bedford in Williamsburg springs to mind. 4th Ave is an interesting idea -- especially if the space included parking. If you want to discuss this further off-line, let me know.
I serve on the board of our regional booksellers association, so I know quite a few booksellers with your level of experience. And some of them have a similarly discouraging view of the future of bookselling. I have to say I disagree. I work now in a New York bookstore that is less than two years old, and that is doing incredibly well. The reasons for this include a beautiful and well-designed space, staff that is welcoming and knowledgeable, unique selection, and a wisely planned location that fills a need in a specific neighborhood. Retail has evolved in the last 25 years, and I know that it's not enough to just stock books. Buying a book at an indie bookstore has to be a good experience, and one that shopping at chains or online just can't duplicate.
Forgive me for being a little hippy-dippy, but I think to some degree you create reality with your view of it. I know several other enthusiastic and passionate young people who have opened up successful independent bookstores in the last couple of years, with a business model focused on creating a great space for customers. And customers are going for it! Buy Local First movements are gaining strength all over the country, and I think in Brooklyn, where neighborhood loyalties are fierce (as this site demonstrates), there must be even more impetus to support local businesses.
Rent is a huge factor in success or failure (colossal rent hikes, not lack of paying customers, are the reason for most bookstore closings in New York), so obviously getting a good rent arrangement will be a primary concern as I open my business. But with good planning, and a space that invites the vibrant activity of Brooklyn in the door, I'm not afraid of failure. The stores that are struggling tend to be those that are resentful of and resistant to change. The ones that are thriving are the ones crazy enough to be optimistic and open-armed about their customers and their neighborhoods.
Thanks for everyone who's posting here, both encouraging and cautious. Your feedback will be part of planning to make my bookstore a success. -
Wow. Keep us posted, as I'm sure I'm not the only one who expects to become a happy loyal customer.
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Jack Krohn wrote: If you think I'm being negative, look at the archives and compare the number of posts about books and culture to those about bars, liquor stores, and getting drunk. I rest my case!
I'm going to answer your joke seriously and say that I don't bring up books here because I talk about them with my friends from school instead. That is to say, I tend to talk about books with people whom I know to have similar interests--not with people who happen to live near me.
Actually, when I see people from DH in real life, we seem to talk about books a great deal. Hmmm. -
booknerdnyc wrote: I work now in a New York bookstore that is less than two years old, and that is doing incredibly well. The reasons for this include a beautiful and well-designed space, staff that is welcoming and knowledgeable, unique selection, and a wisely planned location that fills a need in a specific neighborhood. Retail has evolved in the last 25 years, and I know that it's not enough to just stock books. Buying a book at an indie bookstore has to be a good experience, and one that shopping at chains or online just can't duplicate.
Are you perchance at that newish place on Prince St in NoLiTa? I've been wondering how they've done after the great press for the start up . . . the "Canadian ventures in where many bookstores have folded" story. I've bought books there once - it's just not on my regular path.
Here's what I can add to the market research . . .
I used to buy books at Booklink, one of the many sellers of new books that folded on Seventh Ave in the Slope after modest long-term success. I knew I could get literary and current events magazines there, along with fiction, very popular non-fiction, cookbooks and travel. They merchandised VERY well for the neighborhood. The problem with such a small bookstore was them not having what I wanted in stock, and me not being willing to wait a week for them to order it.
If I want to wait, I order online from Powell's and get a discount purchasing from a non-corporate unionized place. Love that they have awards lists and author interviews. If you click to the main site through the union's site, the union gets some benefit . . .
http://www.powellsunion.com/
The online price issue is really hard to top. I buy cookbooks from Jessica's Biscuit http://www.ecookbooks.com/ cause there's just no way I'm paying $35 for a cookbook. They sell new for about half price.
I go to Housing Works Used Books/Cafe on Crosby just below Houston - okay fiction and really good geeky non-fiction. I also donate books there - great cause, great execution.
I totally agree with the people above who asked for used literary fiction . . . I'd love a bookstore that sold new AND used.
And I too have never managed to walk by that place on Bergen (Flatbush/Fifth Ave) when it's open. :roll:
good luck with your store! -
I agree. That's why I think a slightly bigger store has a better chance; and if the store has accounts with the right book wholesalers, they should usually be able to get specially ordered books by the next day. We indies have to really step up in terms of customer service in order to compete with the convenience of internet ordering, and some are able to do so. On the other hand, we also work by pitching those great books you may never hear of elsewhere.
The problem with such a small bookstore was them not having what I wanted in stock, and me not being willing to wait a week for them to order it.
And yeah, I work at McNally Robinson on Prince Street. It really is exceeding expectations, and I love it there. Glad to hear you've stopped by.
Thanks for the helpful words! -
apollonia666 wrote: Washington is ripe for new businesses and the rents are cheap. And I'd love having a bookstore that close!
I second that! -
Subject: There is already a bookstore nearby.
Hi -
I recently opened a bookstore on Bergen & Flatbush. Grand Opening is upcoming on Sunday November 13. Contrary to rumor, our hours are very regular:
Closed Mondays.
Tues 10 am - 10 pm
Weds 10 am - 10 pm
Thurs 10 am - 10 pm
Fri 10 am - midnight
Saturday 10 am - midnight
Sunday 10 am - 10 pm
Yes, the books are mostly used ones (a very good selection, honestly, and becoming more organized daily), but the new books section is growing, and should be complete by Christmas. Do come visit.
Best wishes to all,
Adam
of Adam's Books
-- That's 456 Bergen St., between Pintchik and City Sub. 20% off all new kids books. 20% off all new hardcovers. 20% off all special orders (we can ship, too.) Excellent deals on rare and hard-to-find books. The best poetry section on the whole long island. -- -
Subject: church ave in kensington ...?
hi book store owner...
Come over to kensington! we are all looking for a bookstore/cafe. there are lots of spaces on church avenue available right near the F train between mcdonald avenue and ocean parkway. be the pioneer!
vox pop (coffee shop-cafe-bookstore-event space) is not in kensington ... it is technically ditmas park/flatbush.
they were having trouble with the book end of it I believe so they are emphasizing the food and drinks and events more now.
There is a small bookstore opening on prospect park west in windsor terrace near windsor place maybe?
good luck! -
Subject: Re: There is already a bookstore nearby.
adamsbooks wrote: Hi -
Congrats, Adam! Sorry to spread rumors about your hours -- I guess I probably usually speed by on my way to work in the morning or home late at night. My fiance is becoming quite a regular in your store, and we'll try probably to make the grand opening. Good on you for opening a new indie store in Brooklyn, and especially for carrying poetry!
I recently opened a bookstore on Bergen & Flatbush. -
i would LOVE and ADORE and FREQUENT a nearby bookstore. (i live on prospect, east of classon, and the books stores in park slope are not worth the schlep for me -- i always end up going into the city)
i would love to be able to order books that stores don't necessarily keep in stock and pick them up locally, rather than having to fight with the p.o. about deliveries from internet places. (besides, once shipping fees kick in, the online stores aren't always such a great deal.)
i do buy a lot of used books -- mostly from the strand -- because i'm a grad student and not rolling in dough.
in my last non-profit job, a time when i was not so rich, either, i ended up going to the borders (don't hate me; there was no indy store in the neighborhoods i frequented most) across the street from my job A LOT because:
1. proximity
2. coffee
3. IMPORTANT: i signed up for their email list and got lots of promotional reminders -- x% off when you buy 3 books; sale on books about topic z, etc. those emails got me in the door; i often ended up buying things that were NOT on sale. they got my $ because they got me in range of my drug of choice.
ps as penance for having mentioned borders, let me plug my favorite chicago bookstores, in case anyone is headed there soon:
women and children first, http://www.womenandchildrenfirst.com/NASApp/store/IndexJsp
the armadillo's pillow, a great little used place around the corner from my old apartment in rogers park. i was there every week, at least once....(hint, hint) -
It would be great to have a book store in the neighborhood! I would be very likely to support it if it went in on Washington or Vanderbilt, but if it went in on 4th, I'd probably continue treking to my usual spots on 7th Avenue. Right now I usually go to 7th Avenue Books for Used Books, or the Community Bookstore (also on 7th) for new.
However, if I am shopping for a gift and I've waited until the last minute as usual, I go to Barnes and Noble because I know that chances are they are 100% more likely to have the exact title I want in stock. -
Subject: Hello...Is this thing on?
It would be great to have a book store in the neighborhood!
As I said earlier, I recently opened a bookstore on Bergen at Flatbush. That's two blocks away from Vanderbilt.
Grand opening upcoming on Sunday November 13.
Cupcake, I'm not sure I understand your use of the subjunctive. -
we need one on washington. or more new blood in the area for almost everything.
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Subject: Re: Hello...Is this thing on?
adamsbooks wrote:
I often misuse the subjunctive, but more often when I'm writing in German.It would be great to have a book store in the neighborhood!
As I said earlier, I recently opened a bookstore on Bergen at Flatbush. That's two blocks away from Vanderbilt.
Grand opening upcoming on Sunday November 13.
Cupcake, I'm not sure I understand your use of the subjunctive.
I look forward to checking out your place. -
Subject: Re: Hello...Is this thing on?
adamsbooks wrote:
adam, i'm looking forward to checking out your store, too.It would be great to have a book store in the neighborhood!
As I said earlier, I recently opened a bookstore on Bergen at Flatbush. That's two blocks away from Vanderbilt.
Grand opening upcoming on Sunday November 13.
Cupcake, I'm not sure I understand your use of the subjunctive.
i didn't know about it until you posted.
booknerd, i still would go to a store that was closer to my place.
heck, i'll go to just about any book store you care to throw my way.
anybody been to the muslim on on park and franklin yet? -
wow! I'd LOVE a bookstore on washington. I buy a LOT of books new, and generally online b/c there are zero bookstores in my regular path. but, if I could pop into a place with a printout from bn or amazon, I'd definitely forgo my online discount to support a local biz that could special order whatever I wanted that wasn't in their regular stock.
adam, I'll check out your place asap (in fact maybe later this afternoon).
booknerd - good luck & keep us posted! -
alafairnadia wrote: if I could pop into a place with a printout from bn or amazon, I'd definitely forgo my online discount to support a local biz that could special order whatever I wanted that wasn't in their regular stock.
alafairnadia, i can certainly do that -- and i do give a 20% discount on all such special orders...
...and if you prepay, i can arrange to have the books shipped directly to you...
-adam -
i stopped by adamsbooks on saturday -- it's great. y'all should check it out.
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bumping this old thread because...
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/brooklyn/2008/01/29/2008-01-29_plan_for_independent_store_nets_prize.htmlPlan for independent store nets prize
BY JOYCE SHELBY
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER
Tuesday, January 29th 2008
Giant bookstore chains such as Borders and Barnes & Noble don't intimidate Jessica Stockton-Bagnulo one bit. She's dreaming of someday opening a small, successful Brooklyn bookshop.
"It's not impossible for an independent bookstore to survive, even when large chains are nearby," said Stockton-Bagnulo, 29, of Park Slope.
Stockton-Bagnulo won the $15,000 grand prize from the Brooklyn Public Library last week to help make her dream come true.
She placed first in the library's fourth annual Power Up! business-plan competition, a contest open to borough entrepreneurs needing start-up or expansion capital.
Had it not been for the contest, Stockton-Bagnulo wrote on her blog (www.writtennerd.blogspot.com), she might not have gotten around to writing her winning business plan.
The grand prize means it will take a lot less time to open the business that Stockton-Bagnulo, who works as an events coordinator at McNally Robinson Booksellers in Manhattan, envisions - "a small bookstore with a cafe, a wine bar, lots of wood and lots of brick."
She's now looking for investors for a store in Fort Greene, Clinton Hill, Windsor Terrace or Prospect Heights.
"I want to go to a neighborhood that needs a bookstore and can support one," she said.
Sponsored by Citigroup, the program shows entrepreneurs how to write business plans, market their products, finance new operations and make them grow.
"We want to encourage more people to consider small businesses and give them the tools they need to be successful," said library Executive Director Dionne Mack-Harvin.
After attending classes at the Cadman Plaza Business Library, entrepreneurs compete for start-up capital and business assistance services.
The Power Up! competition awarded $5,000 each to second-place winners Victoria Watson and Nicole Gates.
Watson of East New York has developed the Matari Lukango line of bath salts and essential body massage oils (www.myspace.com/matarilukango) and she is now working on marketing strategies.
Gates of Prospect Heights plans to open a takeout restaurant, Soul Sister Quisine, in her neighborhood specializing in classic Southern dishes prepared with what she describes as "health-conscious twists."
[email protected] -
Subject: Bookstore!
Thanks for noticing, pitu -- this is me, winning some startup capital! I've still got a long way to go (especially in raising capital), but this is an awesome vote of confidence from the Brooklyn business community. I've been getting a lot of emails from folks in Brooklyn hoping the bookstore will happen in their neighborhood, which is fantastic. I'd love to hear more -- ideas, suggestions, connections, etc. This dream may really happen for this struggling bookseller! -
Good luck and hope that PH gets a bookstore. Would be an excellent addition. None of this walking aaaaaaalllll the way to Park Slope for the B&N.
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please come to PH/CH! god bless unnameable adam's, but it's a LONG walk for me, and the last time i tried to go (4pm on a weekday right before christmas), it was inexplicably closed.
the park slope bookstores are far enough from those of us on the PH/CH border that it makes more sense for me to hop a train to union square (or order online and risk the adelphi post office) than to walk to the stores in brooklyn. if it weren't for skibo, the guy who sells found books for a dollar by mount prospect park, i'd get no books in brooklyn at all.
also, i don't know what your business plan is and how workable a notion this is, but i know i'll buy lots more books if you sell new and used. (used for the price, new for the selection. i'm fairly likely to impulse-buy a used book, but new ones are a bit rich for my present blood, unless it's one i need specifically.)
congratulations on the grant! -
[quote=Carnivore]
weird! i was just thinking this yesterday. i would love a netflix-type program for books.
(and yes, i know the library exists for book-borrowing, but receiving a book in the mail and sending it back is a lot more convenient for my schedule) -
is anyone here a bookcrossing member? i have released something like 20 books since i started using it. the very first book i released was picked up almost immediately, and every other book has just VANISHED. they've been released all over town though. might be better off if i just left them in a central PH location. though it can't be tom's... the one time i tried to release a book there they chased me down the street to give it back!
www.bookcrossing.com if anyone's curious -
abs276 wrote: [quote=Carnivore]
:oops: That was supposed to be a joke! :oops:
weird! i was just thinking this yesterday. i would love a netflix-type program for books.
(and yes, i know the library exists for book-borrowing, but receiving a book in the mail and sending it back is a lot more convenient for my schedule)
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