Park Slope Parents charging for a list serve? Give me a brea

WTGirl wrote: You are kidding right? The list serve is ONLY about the fee this past two days. It gets implemented on May 1.

Whoops, looks like I was wrong. I wonder if they're aware that charging for access to a Yahoo Groups message board is against Yahoo's Terms of Service:

http://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/utos-173.html
Section 12:
NO COMMERCIAL REUSE OF YAHOO! SERVICES

You agree not to reproduce, duplicate, copy, sell, trade, resell or exploit for any commercial purposes, any portion or use of, or access to, the Yahoo! Services (including Content, advertisements, Software and your Yahoo! ID).

The relevant portion of the above:

You agree not to .. sell ... access to, the Yahoo! Services (including Content...)

I'd imagine they could easily get around that. They just have to say that the $25 annual fee is for membership in the Park Slope Parents Group, a local club, and that the listserve is a free service provided to club members to communicate with each other.

BezierBoy wrote: The key word in that last post being "dope".

I heard this listserv is actually a source of a lot of eeevil B.S. busybodying that goes on in the Slope.

Glad I'm still single and childless :twisted:

I'm with you. Thanks god I live in C.G. (is there one of those parent list-serves here??)

whynot_31 wrote: At what point do other people's stereotypes (envy?) of a neighborhood make a resident claim to be from elsewhere?

I was talking to this guy from Astoria in LGA a few months back. He asked me where specifically in Brooklyn I lived - as soon as I said "Park Slope" he replied with just "oh" and lost all interest in talking to me.

I was like WTF, I'm broke, have no kids, rent in the crappiest building on its block, and not in the "historic" area. Stereotype indeed. :x Ever since then I do find myself saying I live in south slope or the south part of PS when meeting people, which is stupid, I know. Once bitten, twice shy?

Carnivore wrote: I'd imagine they could easily get around that. They just have to say that the $25 annual fee is for membership in the Park Slope Parents Group, a local club, and that the listserve is a free service provided to club members to communicate with each other.

Perhaps that would work if it only applied to new members, but how would they explain it if some of the 12,000 people who get kicked off for not paying the fee complain to Yahoo?

Carnivore wrote: I'd imagine they could easily get around that. They just have to say that the $25 annual fee is for membership in the Park Slope Parents Group, a local club, and that the listserve is a free service provided to club members to communicate with each other.

I think they are going to say it is for access to the PSP website.

It doesn't seem to be in the spirit of community to me to charge to use a list serve (where the content is provided for free by users). The original intention of the web was the free exchange of information. Does capitalism have to get into everything? And especially into a supposedly left wing neighborhood who supported Obama (who supports service)?

ALso, if the volunteers are burned out, step aside and let others volunteer or cut back on all the RULES for gods sakes. It is ridiculous to have paid staff on a list serve in my humble opinion

I just think it is a bad precedent to start charging for information that has been historically free. It can be a helpful site to new parents and it is a shame to put a fee on that

Someone needs to bring the competition. Period

Toadette wrote: [quote=whynot_31]At what point do other people's stereotypes (envy?) of a neighborhood make a resident claim to be from elsewhere?

I was talking to this guy from Astoria in LGA a few months back. He asked me where specifically in Brooklyn I lived - as soon as I said "Park Slope" he replied with just "oh" and lost all interest in talking to me.

I was like WTF, I'm broke, have no kids, rent in the crappiest building on its block, and not in the "historic" area. Stereotype indeed. :x Ever since then I do find myself saying I live in south slope or the south part of PS when meeting people, which is stupid, I know. Once bitten, twice shy?

Stupid is an understatement. Why would you care what anyone thought about where you live and why would you be interested in anyone who cared where you live?

WTGirl wrote: It doesn't seem to be in the spirit of community to me to charge to use a list serve (where the content is provided for free by users). The original intention of the web was the free exchange of information. Does capitalism have to get into everything? And especially into a supposedly left wing neighborhood who supported Obama (who supports service)?

ALso, if the volunteers are burned out, step aside and let others volunteer or cut back on all the RULES for gods sakes. It is ridiculous to have paid staff on a list serve in my humble opinion

I just think it is a bad precedent to start charging for information that has been historically free. It can be a helpful site to new parents and it is a shame to put a fee on that

Since when does $25.00 make you "upper middle class and white". You mean blacks can't afford 25.00? Second of all, free exchange of information means freedom of speech. Third, people work hard to gather information and run these groups/listserves. Nothing is free contrary to what you've been told. I belong to a few groups where they either charge a nominal annual fee, or they hold fundraisers a couple of times a year and you make a small or large donation. Your choice. It's my choice to pay or not. I decide if it's worth it to me. Finally, either stop whining or start your own list serve.

eggcream wrote: either stop whining or start your own list serve.

If the whining stops, what will be left of this message board?

I just can't believe I actually agree with eggcream. :shock:

Mamacita wrote: Someone needs to bring the competition. Period

I thought about it, but then decided their (park slope parent's) whining might be worse then ours.

...but we certainly give them a run for their money.

"P.S. 321 doesn't treat my child like royalty" -them

"Why do I have to wait in line behind a stroller" - us

ringrunner wrote: Hey, does the Brooklynian make any money. It is not my business and I don't want to know the answer.

Why doesn't PSP change its format to an ad in the margin message board?

Or

This would be a good time for the Brooklynian to set up a Park Slope Parenting Category.

Whatever, I prefer this type of format to the Yahoo group style.

I am pretty sure Brooklynian already has a "kids' section or something like that. If they wanted to beef it up and make it a true parenting section, i would be more than happy to help.

WT Girl--you seem personally pissed by all this. really, if people want to support "community" then they should support this. And as far as "volunteering to bring people together" -
NAME ONE GROUP IN PARK SLOPE THAT DOES THIS!!
Talk is cheap.
All that talk of "how people would gladly volunteer." HA! right.
When groups do sponsor events--it's always the same people helping out. No former high powered attorney cum SAHM would dare chip her nails.

eggcream wrote:
Since when does $25.00 make you "upper middle class and white". You mean blacks can't afford 25.00? Second of all, free exchange of information means freedom of speech. Third, people work hard to gather information and run these groups/listserves. Nothing is free contrary to what you've been told. I belong to a few groups where they either charge a nominal annual fee, or they hold fundraisers a couple of times a year and you make a small or large donation. Your choice. It's my choice to pay or not. I decide if it's worth it to me. .

The information is provided by the community in the spirit of supporting parents. $25 on top of a computer and internet fee is an expense that believe it or not.....some people cannot afford.

Can you tell me which groups you belong to that chrage a fee? I am actually interested in seeing what a fee gets you compared to free access.

WTGirl wrote: The information is provided by the community in the spirit of supporting parents. $25 on top of a computer and internet fee is an expense that believe it or not.....some people cannot afford.

Can you tell me which groups you belong to that chrage a fee? I am actually interested in seeing what a fee gets you compared to free access.

I don't belong to it, but: the Park Slope Food Coop?

(YES! I checked off the "coop" box on Park Slope Dead Horse Bingo! Whee! )

meganlibrarian wrote:

I don't belong to it, but: the Park Slope Food Coop?

(YES! I checked off the "coop" box on Park Slope Dead Horse Bingo! Whee! )

Thanks. I am actually interested in community list serves that charge a fee. I know the coop charges an initiation fee of $25 and a deposit that you actually get back when you quit. I don't think that is the same thing.

Park Slope Parents are worse than hipsters.

all gyms have a "registration" fee. on top of their costs.
kids classes
amerikick
porn
i know these are all places, but i really can't think of any other group that has created and sponsored so many activities, other than a bank! mind you, i avoid these events like the plague because of all the stroller families..but i certainly think they're worth paying for.

Danny Hellman wrote: [quote=eggcream]either stop whining or start your own list serve.

If the whining stops, what will be left of this message board?

True.

Carnivore wrote: I just can't believe I actually agree with eggcream. :shock:

Cause ya know I'm Right

WTGirl wrote: [quote=eggcream]
Since when does $25.00 make you "upper middle class and white". You mean blacks can't afford 25.00? Second of all, free exchange of information means freedom of speech. Third, people work hard to gather information and run these groups/listserves. Nothing is free contrary to what you've been told. I belong to a few groups where they either charge a nominal annual fee, or they hold fundraisers a couple of times a year and you make a small or large donation. Your choice. It's my choice to pay or not. I decide if it's worth it to me. .

The information is provided by the community in the spirit of supporting parents. $25 on top of a computer and internet fee is an expense that believe it or not.....some people cannot afford.

Can you tell me which groups you belong to that chrage a fee? I am actually interested in seeing what a fee gets you compared to free access.

If you can afford a computer and internet service then you can afford $25.00. If not then you're out of luck.

You still haven't told us what being white has to do with it though. Are you saying there are no black parents on that list ?

And no, I won't tell you what groups I belong to as that is my business but do a Google search and I'm sure you will find tons.

The Chipster wrote: all gyms have a "registration" fee. on top of their costs.
kids classes
amerikick
porn
i know these are all places, but i really can't think of any other group that has created and sponsored so many activities, other than a bank! mind you, i avoid these events like the plague because of all the stroller families..but i certainly think they're worth paying for.

I have another! Zagat restaurant reviews. You have to pay to read information provided for free by the "community." Why is there no outrage that Tim Zagat has loads of money?

Jamzer wrote: [quote=The Chipster]all gyms have a "registration" fee. on top of their costs.
kids classes
amerikick
porn
i know these are all places, but i really can't think of any other group that has created and sponsored so many activities, other than a bank! mind you, i avoid these events like the plague because of all the stroller families..but i certainly think they're worth paying for.

I have another! Zagat restaurant reviews. You have to pay to read information provided for free by the "community." Why is there no outrage that Tim Zagat has loads of money?

You can actually get the books for free if you participate in the surveys, even if you only rate a few places. I think they still charge to get full access (with all features) at the website though, even if you participate in the surveys.

Carnivore wrote:
You can actually get the books for free if you participate in the surveys, even if you only rate a few places. I think they still charge to get full access (with all features) at the website though, even if you participate in the surveys.

to answer a few posts in one:

Zagats: In this case you are paying for the publisher to compile the information, design it, print it. Kind of like a scholarly database. You are paying for the compilation fees and the librarian fees.

In the case of a gym or Amerikick, that is a for profit organization, not ainternet list serve that touts itself as being a community building site for parents.

Believe it or not.....many people do not own computers. They use the computers at the library. I know it is really hard to fathom that there are poor people in the world but believe me, if you get out of your own worldview you might see them......or walk into your public library and see how many people are using the web to job hunt and check email because they can't afford to pay for service at home.

Last time I walked down 7th Avenue, I did see predominanty white faces. Of course there are wealthy people of color in the slope....I am just sayin' if I looked at the demographic breakdown on PSP, I wouldn't be reading a whole lot of voices of color from within the slope. Many members from Prospect Heights, Kensington and LEfferts Gardens.

Wow, what a surprise that this thread turned into a race discussion. Color me shocked.

Maybe shelling out $25 for PSP is worth it... so long as every conversation on the boards doesn't end up devolving into drivel like this one has.

eggcream wrote: [quote=Carnivore]I just can't believe I actually agree with eggcream. :shock:

Cause ya know I'm Right

yep, you are.

besides, people give more per day to the local resident drunks who never do anything but go get lottery tickets, booze and smokes.

i also dont understand other complaints
so hmm maybe pay for a listserv to keep out people who are just posting for the sake of trolling.
not that anyone ever does that here right ?

maybe no childless members cause, kinda like the local playgrounds,
maybe they would prefer to avoid contact with potential predators...

how evil :roll:

Underhill_MT wrote: .
Maybe shelling out $25 for PSP is worth it... so long as every conversation on the boards doesn't end up devolving into drivel like this one has.

b i n g o

Underhill_MT wrote: Wow, what a surprise that this thread turned into a race discussion. Color me shocked.

Maybe shelling out $25 for PSP is worth it... so long as every conversation on the boards doesn't end up devolving into drivel like this one has.

Agreed. I say we charge for access to brooklynian. Who's in!