Biden

boygabriel

daver wrote: Also, there will be a countable number of people who do like Obama cuz he's black, plain and simple.

I find it hard to believe that among independents/undecideds, there are equal numbers of people who vote for or against Obama b/c of race.

(edited for clarity)

noisejoke

I can't believe people are undecided! That always blows my mind.

Then again I can't believe anybody voted for Bush. Everything we knew about him, every personal and professional aspect, came to fruition. I understand the panic and despair that went into "staying the course" of the second term. But were we so lulled by the successes of the Clinton era and so easily put off by his appetites that we allowed such a simplistic buffoon mirror us and take "control"? Did we have Blutarsky and go for Neidermeyer?

The way the Congress, News Media and majority of the public rolled over for the war in Iraq reminded me of Bunuel's Exterminating Angel. Why don't we know better now?

jeffrey

noisejoke wrote: Did we have Blutarsky and go for Neidermeyer?

Neidermeyer: "WHAAAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH YOUR LIFFFFE?!?!?!"

Bush: "I want Iraq"

:twisted:

daver

Boygabriel wrote: [quote=daver]Also, there will be a countable number of people who do like Obama cuz he's black, plain and simple.

I find it hard to believe that among independent or undecideds, there are equal numbers of both.
Obama is currently polling 98% of blacks, which voted 11% for Bush last election.

I'm sure they all changed _just_ because of his politics and that it has nothing to do with his race! Ha!

Not that I'm saying it is a huge advantage, or even a big deal. Just saying.

And as long as I'm saying, let me add that 5% of whites said that they would not vote for a black candidate, period. What is _really_ interesting is that 6% of blacks said that they wouldn't!

boygabriel

daver wrote: Not that I'm saying it is a huge advantage, or even a big deal. Just saying.

You're just trying to sow a little doubt, when no one in their right mind would argue that more people are voting for Obama's blackness than against it.

noisejoke

daver wrote: What is _really_ interesting is that 6% of blacks said that they wouldn't!

I wonder what the numbers are on the old people who won't vote for J. "I left my first wife, and all I got was this blonde, and her daddy's job offer and money" because he's old.

I think I won't vote for him because I'm white.

("I want IRAQ!" That's AWESOME!!!! Somebody buy that man a beer.)

daver

Boygabriel wrote: [quote=daver]Not that I'm saying it is a huge advantage, or even a big deal. Just saying.

You're just trying to sow a little doubt, when no one in their right mind would argue that more people are voting for Obama's blackness than against it.
1) Are you calling me insane? Not in my right mind? How rude.
2) You are the one who has stated the argument that more people are voting for Obama's blackness than against it, I stated that there were people doing so. I have made no comments as to numbers as of yet.

daver

noisejoke wrote: I wonder what the numbers are on the old people who won't vote for J. "I left my first wife, and all I got was this blonde, and her daddy's job offer and money" because he's old.

I don't know, but I do recall reading an article somewhere several months back stating that older people tended to have more problems with his age than average aged folk. Which is interesting.

jeffrey

noisejoke wrote: ("I want IRAQ!" That's AWESOME!!!! Somebody buy that man a beer.)

If I might borrow from daver for a moment...



(hah, mrgreen never gets old)

daver

noisejoke wrote: I think I won't vote for him because I'm white.

My Apache Native American blood makes me wild and unpredictable. And violent. Rawr.

I'm conflicted.

noisejoke

I'm 100% Eastern European Jew (though that doesn't mean much genetically more than 1000yrs back prolly). And I won't vote for Lieberman. Ever.

BTW getting back - I've always really like Biden. Even though he got duped on the war too.

daver

noisejoke wrote: I'm 100% Eastern European Jew (though that doesn't mean much genetically more than 1000yrs back prolly).

Yer screwed dude.

You stated that can't vote for McCain because yer white, and _of course_ you can't vote for Obama because you're Jewish.

You might as well just move to Canada and enjoy their bacon.

noisejoke

Can I vote for Obama's wife? Why can't I vote for his white half? Was he not sucking up to AIPAC enough? Those people can keep their funny fruit, weapons and Kristol to themselves.

Dont' you forget I'm a NY Jew. My "people" are Union, Dems, Ocean Parkway. I can get all the bacon (back or otherwise) I need right here. Though I generally prefer what the Chinese do culinarily with pigs.

daver

noisejoke wrote: Dont' you forget I'm a NY Jew. My "people" are Union, Dems, Ocean Parkway.

You can pick one of these up at Houston and Orchard:

"I am a true anti-Obama New York Jew. The word on the street is that New York Jews will vote for McCain anyhow. The majority of the Jews – at least the ones that are proud of their religion and practice it – like me, don't want to see Obama – a man who's middle name is Hussein, and his family from his Kenyan father's side is Muslim, as the leader of this great country.

More than that, after Obama's pastor, Jeremiah Wright honored Louis Farrakhan – definitely one of the most racist and anti-Semitic people alive – Obama lost us Jews totally. That made me start this political movement in the first place."

In March, the NY Post quoted Brooklyn Assemblyman Dov Hikind's prediction that Jewish voters would be making "a mass movement toward Sen. McCain" should Clinton lose the nomination.

http://gothamist.com/2008/05/12/apollo_braun_de.php

whatchuwant

Man, I really HATE that there are so many people out there that have gotten all up in this "he's a Muslim- look at his middle naaaayyymmm."

So. Freakin'. Ignorant. :roll:

daver

WTF? There was a post here with the following link:
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5670703

Anyway, I'll have to look a bit further, but I think I'm with Corwin.

"Trying to tie the forclosure crisis to the [2005 bankruptcy] bill is a stretch," said the ABA's Corwin.

Especially with laying it on Biden's lap. Dunno.

boygabriel

daver wrote: WTF? There was a post here with the following link:
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5670703

Anyway, I'll have to look a bit further, but I think I'm with Corwin.

"Trying to tie the forclosure crisis to the [2005 bankruptcy] bill is a stretch," said the ABA's Corwin.

Especially with laying it on Biden's lap. Dunno.

His ties to the credit card industry are one of my biggest knocks on him. That and the Iraq War. But at least he admitted he was wrong about Iraq.

daver

Boygabriel wrote: His ties to the credit card industry are one of my biggest knocks on him. That and the Iraq War. But at least he admitted he was wrong about Iraq.

I'm not advocating giving him a pass on the financials, but I don't think it is accurate or fair to state that Biden is personally responsible for the mortgage crisis either.

noisejoke

You mean unlike Graham?

eggcream

Whatchuwant wrote: Man, I really HATE that there are so many people out there that have gotten all up in this "he's a Muslim- look at his middle naaaayyymmm."

So. Freakin'. Ignorant. :roll:

No comment about Wright which is the bigger issue than his middle name according to this article? Personally Wright and Ayers are much more scarier than his middle name.

"More than that, after Obama's pastor, Jeremiah Wright honored Louis Farrakhan – definitely one of the most racist and anti-Semitic people alive – Obama lost us Jews totally. That made me start this political movement in the first place."

doctorj

daver wrote:
Obama is currently polling 98% of blacks, which voted 11% for Bush last election.
And as long as I'm saying, let me add that 5% of whites said that they would not vote for a black candidate, period. What is _really_ interesting is that 6% of blacks said that they wouldn't!

Something odd about the arithmetic here. Either that, or at least 4% of blacks don't t consider Obama black.

daver

doctorj wrote: Something odd about the arithmetic here. Either that, or at least 4% of blacks don't t consider Obama black.

Lol, nice catch. I'm pretty sure that the 98% figure was among likely voters, and the 6% was general population, but I'll check the PDF tomorrow. Which would tend to say something good about likely voters, at least...

doctorj

daver wrote: [quote=doctorj]Something odd about the arithmetic here. Either that, or at least 4% of blacks don't consider Obama black.

Lol, nice catch. I'm pretty sure that the 98% figure was among likely voters, and the 6% was general population, but I'll check the PDF tomorrow. Which would tend to say something good about likely voters, at least...

Ahh, that would explain it. Coming from a place where turnout of adult citizens is always extremely high, because it's illegal not to get your name checked off and accept a ballot at every election, saving a world of confusion, expenditure, and disenfranchisement of minorities, I often forget there's this whole other dimension here of likely voters and turnout.