why are the American poor refused to do jobs that are there?

cool the kid · December 2011

booklaw said:

CTK, being addicted to tobacco is not a simple matter of "choice" or self-control. Nor is obesity. Both involve physical and mental dependencies.
As both a former tobacco addict, and a formerly obese person, I can tell you that without access to medical care (prescription drugs in the case of tobacco addiction, and surgery to deal with the obesity), I could never have remedied either problem.
If you make that medical care prohibitively expensive, then there are going to be a lot more obese people and smokers, with all of the diabetes, cancer, heart attacks and strokes that that implies.
That becomes very expensive for society at large. It's bad policy.

Addiction & psychology are definitely a part of it, and different people have different levels of resistance/willpower.

Plus I never said curing one's own obesity or getting off of tobacco was easy.

But there is definitely a large element of choice in tobacco/alcohol addiction & obesity. If you regularly consume drugs to the point that it is detrimental to your health and you choose not to seek help, is it fair for society to pick up the tab for your eventual demise?

If you are obese and aren't willing to make drastic lifestyle changes + put in the effort to lose weight, is it fair to demand that society cover your eventual complications and ER visits?

I have a lot of buddies who have lost a lot of weight through nothing but changing their diets and exercising. One of my best friends is a cyclist who races... in high school/college he weighed well over 300lbs and lost a good 100+ lbs and is in phenomenal shape. So no offense but I don't buy that.

I agree though that there is a predatory and at times counterproductive element to the self-help & lifestyle change agencies out there. A lot of personal trainers suck and don't address the fundamental problems of their clients. There has to be a more holistic + clinical approach... which could be addressed through healthcare reform. But people also have to put in the effort (not to say you didn't... you might just have not had good support/guidance).

booklaw · December 2011

It is a hell of a lot easier to lose major weight at age 20 or even 30 than it is at or after age 40. The body's metabolism changes, and family life and the need to earn a living prevent the dedication of serious time to training and racing and other forms of weight-loss exercise.

As for addiction, all it takes is a couple of packs of cigarettes for many people to become too addicted to break free without expensive medical assistance.

As a society, we cannot afford the medical and workforce costs of losing people to cancer, diabetes, heart attacks, strokes, etc.

You suggest that we say, "we should each be responsible for our own health, and for avoiding self-indulgent behavior such as drugs or overeating, so our taxes should not pay to treat those who irresponsibly become obese or addicted." However, the societal costs (economic, psychological and sociological) are simply too great.

John Wayne, Clint Eastwood, and John Galt are not the sum total of our society, and, notwithstanding Tea Party crazies, writing off the rest of the country will ultimately prove unacceptable to the majority.

whynot_31 · December 2011

One thing is certain: We are becoming a nation of obese people, many of whom are also old.

The irony of it all is that somehow folks believe they will never need the care, hence they are unwilling to pay for others to have it.

We thus end up with a classic program in which everyone wants the benefits, but no one wants to pay in. .... Or a situation in which we feel others have an obligation to pay in, but not us.

As long as we stay healthy, this will remain merely a tiresome debate.

It is denial....

whynot_31 · December 2011

P.S. The dismantling of the safety net is progressing as many expected.

I'm just waing to see who Alabama is going to get to fill all those agricultural jobs that are now available due to its immigration law. ....Alabama isn't a generous safety net state, so I doubt it has a very good reserve pool of laborers presently on the dole.

The Supreme Court agreed to review Arizona's law, so we might get some direction....

why are the American poor refused to do jobs that are there?

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