no more Syd's Serious Sandwiches
Comments
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852 is the former daycare, not Glenda's, right?
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Gentrification politics aside, and just out of curiosity - I imagine Zev is not the only landlord on Nostrand avenue who would like to rent his/her spaces for more. What has he done that the other landlords haven't, in order to swing all these prime tenants? I think a single landlord owns the somewhat similar strip of stores where Tintos is now, and the large space that used to be Café 400, on the corner of Nostrand and Sterling. But that space has had for rent signs up for at least a few years now:

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The Palace building is landmarked, making it less attractive to businesses who want to do the type of renovations described above.
Returning to the soon-to-be passive house:
"The property has traded hands five times over the past decade, with the first sale in 2005 for just $390,000. The latest sale came earlier this year for $1.23 million"
It think it is reasonable to assume very few improvements to the building were made during this time. This is skill and luck at work.
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Most of Nostrand between Atlantic and EP is owned by a small number (3-4) of landlords. Most of the businesses on the avenue are pretty stable and provide them with regular revenue often with very little work on their part in terms of maintenance and upkeep. At the same time, while they certainly can get top dollar from new businesses, they also need to make investments in the properties to make it happen. I'm not sure they are interested in making huge investments, and they know that time is on their side. Nostrand isn't going to be bypassed as the Franklin Avenue gentrification wave crests over the rest of CH.
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Syd's is going to be a latin cafe and sit down restaurant, combined with the barbershop space next door who Zev, the landlord, pushed out so he could have a gentrification business. Zev owns the four store fronts being discussed, here.
It seems like you are using "generations" liberally. Being that a generation is approximately 25 years, may I remind you that a few, or even a couple, generations ago, most of the current inhabitants where not living in the area. And the cycle continues... The same way they arrived, others arrive, and the area changes accordingly.I really hope these new places have some low price drink specials, hire locals and feature local art and music. It makes me really sad to see Nostrand Ave changing in a way that conforms to fit the white people who have moved in, while kicking out those who have lived here for generations. -
Syd's friends and family seem to have not been able able to meet his needs:$4,675 USDRAISED OF $75,000 GOAL
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I wanted to give money but the whole flexible funding thing made me pretty uneasy.
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@homeowner - Okay; and your point? I agree with you 100%. And how many people living in crown heights are their decedents? The black "culture" in CH today, primarily Caribbean, is likely very different than it was then. It has nothing to do with race or religion. Communities change! And the local culture at that time is affected.Looking at it differently - Would it be okay if Jews complained back in the day when synagogues started changing to churches (for the most part). Would it have been right for them to request that they all be preserved (along with all the delis, etc. which likely dotted the area) for the sake of "culture" and avoid "changing in a way that conforms to fit the white [new] people who have moved in," as @rikilynnso eloquently put it?And just because I found it interesting... Brownstoner: Walkabout: The Temples of Bed Stuy and Crown Hts North - http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2010/02/walkabout-the-t/
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You are comparing apples and potatoes. The synagogues changed because the Jewish community voluntarily moved out of the neighborhood (with the exception of the Hassidim) relocating to Long Island, New Jersey, Staten Island and Westchester County. They left behind empty temples which were then repurposed into houses of worship by those moving into the neighborhood. At no point in time did the incoming residents suggest that there were too many synagogues and perhaps folks would be better off if one or two were converted to another use. There were no requests to preserve the culture because the people you speak of abandoned those institutions.That is vastly different than the situation of people of color living in places like Crown Heights where whites are moving in and then opining on which businesses, institutions, and traditions should be replaced because they see no value in them.And to answer your question, my family has lived in central Brooklyn (Ft Greene, Clinton Hill, Bed-Stuy and Crown Heights) since 1916. There are plenty of current residents in CH including many of the Caribbean families that can trace their family roots in this community back fifty to sixty years or more.
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So apples and potatoes = voluntary and involuntary (or said otherwise, priced out). I have trouble buying that argument.If one argues "culture," it shouldn't be dependent on whether those who created the culture left voluntarily or not. It's not about why they left; it's about the history of the area.Side point - you may want to watch the documentary discussed here - http://www.brooklynian.com/discussion/44261/great-documentary-on-pbs-this-week-my-brooklyn/p1; some may argue that "they" were forced/kicked out, albeit under different circumstances/market conditions.And the whole premise of the argument bothers me. It seems that the argument is that when landlords take action to do what is best for them (their families, or with companies, for investors/shareholders), it is wrong. Sorry; arguing this is antithetical to capitalism. This argument is basically demanding "charity," which I find absurd.No one is "kicking" anyone out. The landlords have a right to charge market rate, and the tenants have to adjust accordingly. Again, demanding that one take less than they "deserve" (determined by supply and demand), is demanding that they give you what is rightfully theirs, i.e., charity.And about the retail - again, supply and demand. Retail will follow demand and profits.Based on your username, you appear to be a homeowner so you are definitely not being "kicked out." But if you will miss the current retail environment, remember supply and demand. I've wanted a Gap within walking distance for 30 years, and I didn't get it. Can you guess why? I would have also really liked to have that CH theater district still around while I was growing up, but alas, it's gone. Can you guess why? How about all the car dealerships? Free markets and the supply and demand curve that comes with it! And we can't complain; it's one of the main things that makes this country so great.
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Just because we live in a capitalist society doesn't mean that it's "absurd" to argue anything for our communities that's not purely market-driven economics.@homeowner thank you for sharing your perspective. As a relative new comer to crown heights, I feel very uncomfortable about my own role in the gentrification of the neighborhood. I love the feeling of community that exists here and how warm and welcoming the majority of the Caribbean residents have been to me. I love being able to eat doubles and oxtail stew. I wouldn't want to see Nostrand become as bland as Smith st. If everything is driven by an individualistic desire for profit, then I think that new comers have a responsibility to try and frequent existing businesses as much as possible and spend their money there.I do like eating brunch and drinking fancy coffee, and while I get excited when new places that match my interests open, I'm most excited about the ones that manage to cater to the entire community of Crown Heights. For example, I far prefer Tinto's to Lula Bagel, because they go out of their way to make everyone who comes in feel welcome. Urban Asanas and Martine's Dream, both owned by black women who live in the neighborhood, are other good examples of new businesses on Nostrand that appeal to a wide range of residents.@southeast I don't see the point in shouting down the voices that aren't unilaterally thrilled by change. Community and culture are just as important as capitalism.
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@laura palmer - You make very valid points. Particularly, when you mention the responsibility of newcomers to try and frequent existing businesses, that is, if they feel that they'd like to keep them around. It's an individual choice.And although it may not seem like it at times, my arguments are not intended to shout down the voices that aren't unilaterally thrilled against change. I totally understand where they are coming from. As with any cycle, there are times when one is on the bottom and times when one is on the top, and I'm trying to highlight this. Sometimes it goes your way, and sometimes, it doesn't. My family has experienced this ourselves over our time living in CH and still experiencing it today. While there are things that we may embrace, there are many, what I may perceive as, negatives that come along with it.Using words like "kicked out" or "greedy" (not in this conversation, but I'm sure you've heard it around). etc. is wrong and incorrect. It just creates and contentious environment.And what bothers me most is the sense of entitlement that people show at times; and that it is so shocking that this phenomenon is taking please. If one wants to have an influence, one can't just scream and complain and create an environment of negativity. One has to do something productive; and shouting, is not productive, and so isn't applying unnatural economic pressures. Your suggestion, however, of providing demand, is.
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I can't say it bothers me that people want their neighborhoods to reflect their means and preferences, and that they complain when they perceive it changing in ways that move further from same.
What bothers me is people who tell such people, "You should be happy, you are going to get to stay here and benefit from the arrival of us. You are going to get to enjoy our BETTER means, and our BETTER preferences"
...by artificially simplying the situation, such newcomers implicitly call long term residents "NIMBYs", "racists", "old", etc.
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@southeast, I want to be very clear. I've never used the words "kicked out" to describe what's been happening in the neighborhood. I, like Whynot understand that we are simply seeing market forces play out. However, I am very disturbed by attempts to re-write history when it comes to Brooklyn. The argument that people complaining about change have been here a relatively short time and therefore do not deserve to have opinions is simply factually incorrect. While there are many families living here that are one generation Brooklyn residents, there are just as many that are 3, 4, or 5 generations.And to your point that people can't just scream and complain, I'd suggest that many of the people of whom you speak are simply frustrated. They have lived in this neighborhood for many years, understanding that if they wanted a meal at a sit down restaurant or to shop in a local thrift store it might require a trip outside of the neighborhood. When these types of businesses have finally come to where they live, rather than welcoming their patronage, these businesses seem to not want to cater to current residents. If they don't fit the demographic (young and hip) they find that service and attention is often lacking. Even if they do fit the demographic, service and attention is often sub-par.So, what can they do? They can choose not to patronize these establishments, but that seemingly has zero impact. So they rant at CB meetings, at their churches and block association meetings and in their living rooms about how the neighborhood is changing. And then they are told that they should shut up. That they should be happy and are accused of being everything from ungrateful to uneducated criminals that simply don't know any better. If this happened to you, wouldn't you be negative as well?
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"That they should be happy and are accused of being everything from
ungrateful to uneducated criminals that simply don't know any better."
Such perceptions are furthered by the statement/belief that "If you don't like what is coming, you must be in favor of what was here".
um, no. ....that is not what it means. -
@homeowner - My comments began as a response to @rikilynn's statement: "It makes me really sad to see Nostrand Ave changing in a way that conforms to fit the white people who have moved in, while kicking out those who have lived here for generations." Note the "kicking out."I think you and I (and @whynot_31 for that matter) are on the same page for the most part (at least when it comes to this subject
). We may just be focusing on different aspects. I totally get the frustration. I just can't accept the "rant" as well as you seem to be able to.Also, side point - I am also focusing on CH in particular; not Brooklyn as a whole or even Central Brooklyn. Not that it changes anything but it may help you understand where I'm coming from. As an example, if someone moved (willingly or unwillingly) from Fort Greene or Clinton Hill, or anywhere else in Brooklyn for that matter, to CH, during this generation and is now complaining about the change, please! The same way they moved here, other are moving here, and with the others, may come change that is more pronounced than the change that they brought; such is life. Everyone should really ask themselves how they got here and what change they brought with them, however slight; be it something new or strengthening something old. -
This person is bringing almost $3M in change to St. Marks between Rogers and Nostrand.http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2014/12/19/this_crown_heights_townhouse_just_sold_for_nearly_3m.php?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=1498110BTW, this bar/restaurant is one of several upscale places that is expected to on Nostrand by June 1: http://www.brooklynian.com/discussion/45049/the-nostrand-ave-takes-flight-spring-2015-thread#Item_2
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As a result of @vaportrail seeing a sign stating it will become a coffeeshop, let's close this thread and continuing jabbering here:
This discussion has been closed.
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